Why do Christians want to be part of a religion that Jesus did not endorse?

by AK - Jeff 20 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    A book called THE JESUS PAPERS makes the (wild, admittedly) claim that there currently exists a document written by Jesus that discusses his being charged with blasphemy for claiming to be the son of God, but that he is only a son of God in the same sense that all of us are sons of God.

    The conspiracy to suppress information may not have gone that far or it may have. The document may not actually exist, but it may or it may have in the past.

    The established 4 gospels don't even fully agree on things, let alone the additional writings found later that were probably destroyed by the Roman Catholics or others trying to keep the stories out of their history.

    The point is similar to what you said about Kennedy. The tales grew taller after the facts. Perhaps we need to examine the possibilities from the more rational viewpoint that he was a wise MAN.

    Perhaps a better example would be a bit older. The Haulocaust is actually denied several decades later. One group (the JW's) tries to highlight how their members were such tragic victims of the haulocast and they virtually ignore the Poles or the Gypsies, those groups possibly doing the same. Abraham Lincoln became the saviour of the slaves and most African Americans became Republicans back then. There is overwhelming evidence that his main concern was political and had little to do with freeing slaves, yet history won't let the truth stand in it's way. Columbus discovered America, despite the fact that he wasn't first, didn't know what he found.

  • glenster
    glenster

    An attempt to determine history should also consider that, whether you believe
    them or not, people make the kind of claims that call on faith of the Jesus of
    the mainstream Christian view. Here we are on a board about the JW leaders, for
    example, and others who have claimed to be propets or the Messiah have appeared.
    The choice about Jesus isn't restricted to mainstream Christian or a guy who
    didn't make the mainstream claims. The earliest mainstream indication would be
    the earliest of Paul's writings, about 16 (?) years after the crucifixion, which
    refer to him having previously led others to persecute followers for praying to
    Jesus so Paul did when he converted.
    http://gtw6437.tripod.com/id22.html

  • sacolton
    sacolton

    I thought Jesus "invisibly" approved the Watchtower in 1918? Yes, it's true that no one actually witnessed this grand event (because he was invisible - duh.) but that's beside the point. Well, actually that is the whole point.

    What was the question again?

  • sir82
    sir82

    Once you look at the individual books of the Bible as just that, individual books, and not as "chapters" in some grand united anthology, questions like this get answered. Each writer had a different audience and a different message in mind.

    For example, Matthew wrote his gospel for Jews, and you can see all sorts of things there that aren't in the other gospels. The whole sermon on the mount, reproduced only in bits and pieces in Luke and nowhere else, is essentially a lecture on how to be a better Jew - follow the spirit of the Law, not just the letter. Plus his comments on coming, not to destroy the law, but fulfill it, and how "heaven and earth" would pass away before the Law's demise, etc.

    John's gospel, on the other hand, is (among other things, of course) more focused on breaking away from Judaism - being born again, following a new commandment, etc.

    Someone from the planet Brglsgrp who came to earth and read Matthew and nothing else, and then decided to become a Christian, would be a very very different type of Christian than someone from the planet Lhuyganso who read the gospel of John and nothing else.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Well, if we are to focus on the most ancitent writings about Jesus then we would have to focus on:

    Paul's letters because they are the "oldest" examples we have of Christian writing, with Thessalonians, Philipians, Galations, Corinthians (1,2), Romans, Philemons, Colossians, all written BEFORE the Gospel of Mark.

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    Interesting.

    I wonder if in 2000 years, someone uncovers the 'Sacred Internet Logs' of say, the Flying Spaggetti Monster, how that would go?

    Once they sort out who wrote what, and then find ways to attribute those writings to the FSM himself by 'inspiration', will there be millions of people waiting for death and being raised a mushroom in His Grand Sauce? Or will they just agree that some fanatical or comical writer made it up?

    Just asking.....

  • God_Delusion
    God_Delusion

    I personally think the Pastafarian's will be the dominant religious movement in 2,000 years. They currently have a small movement at the moment (about 2 followers I think). They basically worship the Spaghetti Monster and all his wonderous works.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    AK,

    As I am sure you know, it didn't take 2000 years to discover the writings that now comprise the NT.

    I don't recall which are the oldest available writings we do have, I know the codex siniaticus is about last 2nd century, but I think there are older texts than that.

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff
    As I am sure you know, it didn't take 2000 years to discover the writings that now comprise the NT.

    No, it took a couple of centuries to sort it out. Then a few more to 'gather' worshippers. Then a few more to 'refine' doctrine and culture.

    The beauty of the Pastafarian religion is that the documents are already confirmed as genuine, writers identified, records made to assure that no gnostic or apostate materials can infiltrate the Pasta canon. Unlike the first century, today the technology exists to assure that the Holy Spaghetti Book will not be tampered with.

    You must admit, that the Pastafarians have at least as much credo as the Christians in proving that God inspired them? I know this only because I have time and again asked Christians to simply 'prove it', and they never do. Most of them just jump in a circle and begin quoting the book that I asked them to verify. Kinda like me quoting 2 Noodle 4:8 to prove that the Flying High One is real. Circular is not pretty.

    Jeff

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    When Jesus lived, he just didn't teach, he ordained others and called them to be apostles ("sent ones") to the nations. He said that the only way to the Father was through him. He established a church and ordinances. Ghandi didn't. "He who believeth on me, though he be dead, yet shall he live," the Lord said. As time passed, the apostles were killed and driven from city to city. The church was corrupted and inculated with secularism and rhetoric. Then the Lord decided to start his church anew, this time through a publishing company that printed Bibles and tracts...well...that's the way the JWs see it, anyhow. Still, Jesus was a religious figure and met all the critieria of the Jewish Messiah, except the military aspect. Upon his return, he is expected to fulfill that aspect, too.

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