Contribution of Franz books on your decision to leave?

Damocles

The recent resurrected topic on Franz' books got me curious.

How much did his writing contribute to your decision to leave?

For myself, it was another brick in the wall but not more important than any other. I was a little different than most in that I regularly read anti-witness stuff from the very beginning and never stopped. If you are correct in your beliefs, you don't fear the opposition - you learn and grow from it.

COC for me was a confirmation of what I already thought, although I loved the details of the operation. I always figured that if you wanted to know how things worked with the GB look at local elders. JWs are such a top-down, controlling group that the local congregation should be a near perfect reflection of the GB. Franz confirmed that opinion. It all had the ring of truth.

Also, he confirmed for me that precedent and organizational survival were paramount. Nothing tops those two guiding lights. And how is that different than any other organization, religion or business? Not much in my opinion.

On the negative side, I never really bought his self-justification that he left as a result of conscience. He was kicked out after all, he didn't resign. Not that I want to judge. JWs F%&k with your mind so much that we all leave in our own ways and no one is in a position to judge another in that regard IMHO. Leaving with sanity and some dignity intact is sufficient. Curiously, though, his inability to sell me on that idea made the veracity of the rest more sure in my mind.

Damocles

AK - Jeff

CoC and ISoCF were the cornerstones to our understanding the false nature of the religion. We finally got up the guts to order them in the fall of 2003. They arrived in a few days. We began to voraciously devour them. Couldn't put them down. There was a real thirst to understand what was wrong with the organization and this quenched it. We never set foot inside a Kingdom Hall again. We had been Jw's since birth or almost for me [age of 4 mom began to study]. I was 48 when we left.

Jeff

dissed

No, I just started to read the book and have been out for 13 years.

For an active JW to read the book means crossing one large line. Before the Web, you would have had to ignore the warnings, walk into a book store, and usually order the book. Almost an impossible thing, for even someone fading back then.

The Web makes it so much easier. You can read an excerpt, on your computer without anyone ever knowing you are experimenting with the evil deed.

The wall the JW's have made for the book is nothing short of incredible and puts fear into the avg. JW.

My old CO told me the book mentioned the following.

Ray was extremely bitter that he wasn't chosen as WTS President and was seeking revenge.

Ray was trying to start a new religion where he taught Hell Fire, the Trinity, to name a few.

He condoned immorality, everyone could do as they wished and no DF'd.

With that stuff facing you, what respectable JW would read it.

Every JW should be asking the question, Why are they so afraid of this guy?

Damocles

Jeff,

Cool!

Maybe thats some of the difference in perspective. I joined in my 20s (1970) so I had some experience with religions. There is a real difference between those that are raised dubs and those that joined. Gives me a fair amount of guilt since I raised children as dubs.

Anway, thanks for sharing. I like the different perspective.

Damocles

Dissed,

I agree. If Franz is that out of it, what's to fear? Should be nothing. Objections should strengthen your beliefs as you find good ways to combat the wrong ideas...not the other way around.

Thanks

Damocles

Opus92

I've been out for more than 10 years, so Franz didn't help me leave. But reading COC did help fill my need for answers about my (lack of a) childhood, my douts about JWs, and my lingering JW beliefs.

It doesn't matter how he left. Honestly, it doesn't even matter that he did leave to me. It was the extensive documentation that sold me on him and his book. I spent my life having to listen to my mother parrot whatever the WTBTS taught. Now I have something to refute her arguments (even if I never use it).

Damocles

Opus,

Thanks.

Got me to thinking, I don't believe any of my children (in or out) have read COC, not that it wasn't around the house for them to read. Curious, I do wonder what they would think of it.

Damocles

troubled mind

I had already made my decision to fade ,but I held onto feeling guilty about my decision . All I wanted was to find some peace of mind and be happy . After I read both of Ray Franz books I no longer had those feelings of guilt .

leavingwt

Crisis of Conscience was only the second apostate book I read. As such, it was VERY influential.

I went on to read dozens of books and to spend hundreds of hours reading Internet articles/forums.

The two books that 'sealed the deal' for me were Crisis of Conscience and Combatting Cult Mind Control. Each of these focus on two very different, but important aspects of what being a JW is all about. They allow you to connect the dots, to understand the complete picture of deception.

OnTheWayOut

I already resigned as an elder before I started posting on JWD and I only discovered then that a former GB member had written those books. I was still "active" when I read them (granted, active only in that I turned in field circus reports with 1 hour on them). I ordered them, had them delivered to my dad's house, a two-hour drive away. Before they could arrive, I found COMBATTING CULT MIND CONTROL and CRISIS OF CONSCIENCE at the library and read them.

I had already discovered enough from freeminds.org and jwfacts.com and a handful of other sites that WTS was a dangerous mind-control cult. But those books sealed my decision to fade fast. I think the Steve Hassan book (COMBATTING) was more important to me than the Ray Franz books. Doctrine was important to me, and Ray showed me how WT doctrine was flawed, but the Cult books I read showed me that WTS was just another dangerous cult- not anything like a true religion with a few major flaws.

CoC was and is so successful at helping members because it is so "Not Bitter" and because it comes from someone who was not only near the top, but instrumental in writing so much for the WT.

Contribution of Franz books on your decision to leave?

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