by Lady Liberty 85 Replies latest jw friends
P.S. Perry,
You are very right.
Many times the reason a person is df'd is not to help them come to "repentance," rather it is sometimes, as was the case with my daughter, to exhibit power over them, to berate, and humiliate, and make them feel worthless as a human being.
Sometimes small minded men want to have a power trip. Who better for five men to beat up but a small, shy teenaged girl.
This is an abusive comment to others who do not share your experience. It implies that other mothers who shun do not have affection for their children. It is arrogant of you to imply this. Further, it is false.
There's nothing "abusive" about sharing a personal experience. If you want to cry "abuse" maybe you should be pointing your finger at those who, contrary to all that is natural, make a conscious effort to shun their own flesh and blood. Watchtower policies do not invalidate personal responsibility, especially when a persons actions go beyond what the watchtower dictates.
It is because they are not grounded in the bible, and are DECEIVED, that they go along with this hideous practice.... not because they don't care.
Being grounded in the bible has little to do with it. Most people who have never opened a bible would recognize this behaviour as abnormal and abusive. I don't deny that these shunners love their families. I'm saying that they love their cult more and they act accordingly. When some go beyond what the watchtower dictates, I can't help but wonder if these people actually enjoy hurting others and are just using watchtower policies as an excuse for bad behaviour.
Perhaps your mother, doesn't "love" you enough to shun you. Ever thought about that?
Not so relevent any more since she's dead, but I thought of it and soon laughed it off. Our relationship actually improved after I DA'd. She was constantly trying to get me to go back to the JWs, and I guess she knew that treating me like dirt wasn't the way to go about it. Even on her deathbed she was trying to talk me into going back.
W
Quandry,
I know how you feel. I felt that way too at first. But what I found was that counselors will not offer the scriptural support necessary to defeat the JW theology using the bible. Without that, all you have is advice from "worldly" people, which will be quite suspect for some time after a person leaves.
For me it was liberating not just to have "another opinion", but to have God's opinion.
Instead of propping up self-esteem and dumping on grandma, why not train our young ones to ask biblical questions that the WT has no answers for? Let them experience first hand the rebellion of the elders and of their relatives to the authority of Christ. They think they are doing God a favor by shunning. Make them explain it.
I take my wife and children to a Kingdom Hall from time to time and ask to see some elders. There, we have a discussion as a family so that my wife and children can reinforce truth while at the same time plant seeds for my JW neighbors. I have many questions that I wished that Christians would have taken the time to ask me when I was a regular pioneer.
I flat out tell JW's that I'd be happy to attend a Kingdom Hall if they could show me JUST ONE SCRIPTURE how a person can get their sins forgivin while outside of the new covenant. And I mean it. There are others:
Why did Jesus command to "keep doing this" in rememberance of me and JW's don't eat the Lord's Supper?
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. - Gal. 1: 8
These are just a few examples. Our children don't need pity, they need our leadership. My children certainly do not need the secular philosophy that permeate our public schools.
When I got baptized I meant it. I ain't jumping into the fire just because some false teachers can't defend their position. Besides it is way too much fun talking to JW's now that I know the OT sacrifices weren't for a sweet smelling odor and Jesus didn't die for Adam. www.wordfamine.com
I reccommend that every ex-JW try success and winning for a change rather than victimization.
PERRY- You are wrong, wrong, wrong my friend. You made the statement about JW parents , " The ones that shun the most obediently , may be the ones who " love " them the most and would do anything , in their mind, to help them get back on the road to life. " That's absolute BS. It's a falsified teaching of the WT society which influences Jehovah's Witnesses to believe that by shunning their DFed children or inactive relatives that it's showing love in the long run to them. Nothing is further from the truth. It is emotional abuse at it's worst - complete shunning. It is inhumane and totally unacceptable.
If those same parents would do " anything " as you say to " help " their children- why don't they try exiting the mind control cult Jehovah's Witnesses and use their freaking authentic brains in order to show true human affection to their children they are shunning - instead of giving all their thought control to the deceptive leaders of the WT society.
Perhaps ex-JW adult children who are shunned could turn mind controlled JW parents like Lady Liberty's mother in law back into real human beings if they shed the abusive cult mind control exercised by the witnesses
When some go beyond what the watchtower dictates, I can't help but wonder if these people actually enjoy hurting others and are just using watchtower policies as an excuse for bad behaviour.
That is not a class I want to sign up for.
The simple fact is that associating with a relative who has become a Christian after being a JW is a disfellowshipping offense. Their own skin is at stake. They are deceived and do not want to forfeit ressurrection. I can understand that perfectly.
We can take offense, blame them ...or we can have compassion and arm ourselves with the word of God and the power of the Spirit.
If those same parents would do " anything " as you say to " help " their children- why don't they try exiting the mind control cult Jehovah's Witnesses
Because they are deceived and don't know they are in a cult. It really is that simple. They don't want to die at Armageddon. Can't you have any compassion for the self-preservation response flipper?
PERRY- You asked me, " Can't you have any compassion for the self-preservation response Flipper ? " Well- No, I can't . Not when it comes to inhumanely shunning ones children or grandchildren which God HAS NOT commanded - especially if the grandchild is not even BAPTIZED as a JW ! And I don't have ANY respect or compassion for any grandparents who even IF they believe in an alleged " Armageddon " would value saving their own skin by avoiding their grandchildren. It's absolutely stupid and inhumane ! And since I believe Armageddon is a guilt trip fantasy that ALL religions put on people to keep them in fear - it makes it even MORE of an inhumane waste of relationships and time to use this as an emotional whipping post on a 10 or 11 year old grandaughter.
PERRY- You sound as if you are full of superstion and religious fantasy too
Lady Liberty, I've been thinking about your situation for a while, and my suggestion would be for your daughter to tell her grandmother how her actions made her feel horrible. As you said, your daughter is not baptized- why is she being punished?
Any action taken by you will probably be discounted since you're disfellowshipped. But a heart-wrenching card from your daughter to Mean Grandma that starts with, "I don't know what I did to make you hate me, Grandma" and ends with, "At least my other Grandma loves me and shows it" might give her the slap in the face that she richly deserves.
...and send Mean ex-Grandma a copy of the new family photo with Loving Replacement Grandma standing right next to your daughter!
PERRY- You asked me, " Can't you have any compassion for the self-preservation response Flipper ? " Well- No, I can't .
I can understand that. It is against our nature. I couldn't do it either until I asked Jesus to come into my life and do it for me.
I believe Armageddon is a guilt trip fantasy that ALL religions put on people
I suggest you investigate Christianity then. Because Armageddon is a military conflict where Jesus saves people, not destroys them. "Unless those days were cut short no flesh would be saved".
The bottome line is that all this victimization rolls downhill. The Wt victimizes it members with their false theology. Members victimize people who find out that they are not perfect and leave or are kicked out. In turn, some of the ones who leave turn around and victimize the members by shunning, attacking them personally, or by trying to get even. All the while, the WT sits high and mighty unassailed with their false teachings, while we all fight each other. Can't you see that?
Another approach is to go on the offensive, treating people the way you would want to be treated irregardless of deservedness. Like I said, this is a spiritual battle. I've experienced that fighting the spiritual with the flesh is impossible.
It can bring a great deal of satisfaction asking a JW a question they are not prepared to answer....like how are their sins forgiven outside of the New Covenant. I can trace my own exit to one door that I was at while out in field service when a lady took her bible and explained her faith to me. God, took those seeds and grew them to where eventually I was able to exchange my life with Christ.
Once that happened God took away my fear, anger and feelings of victimization. I can now have compassion for active JW's because of my security and relationship with Jesus. Anytime, anywhere I can show from the bible how the WT and its members are living a life in rebellion to God, from their own bible. I keep quotes in my wallet showing how the WT teaches that Jesus is not the mediator of the Great Crowd. They are alone before God.
It is up to them and God after that. Truth is empowering and it leaves behind the entrenchment of victimization.
