The Caring Elders (page 5)

straightshooter

Definitely go the Matthew 18 route and pursue it all the way.

jambon1

Whay are so many elders complete arseholes?

dissed

Elders do not like to be embarrassed when it comes to Mt 18.

Step one is for her to go to him alone. She may feel she has already done that by mentioning the damage, but she hasn't. It has to be formally mentioned that you are following step 1 in Mt 18 when you meet.

He will squirm when confronted, try and talk his way out of it.(usually by blaming the victim) But will do whatever it takes to keep this quiet. (I love to watch them squirm don't you?)

That's the hardest part for her. If it progresses to step 2, a competent witness, (an elder) will carry the load for her.

If the guy is a total jerk and still refuses to any agreement, then two good witnesses will take care of the rest.

But, I'm telling you, Elders know what this means, removal as an Elder is at stake, and the moment he realizes that, he will beg, grovel, and squirm to keep this quiet.

cantleave

I have actually spoken to her now, and have the full facts. I know the Elder concerned and he is an A-Hole!

I have explained the Matthew 18 route to the sister and sand provided her with a strategy. She wanted me to be involved but I told her it would be more appropriate if a serving Elder gets involved not an Ex-Elder. So..... on Sunday she is going to speak to the "Brother Karz" and is going to present, what will be for her a satisfactory solution, one that after talking to me, she knows will not present hardship to the Elder and will get her car fixed.

If that doesn't work she is going to involve her congregation secretary, he really sound Elder, who I know quite well so I have pre-warned him. He was aware of the situation to some extent and agrees that this sister needs to be treated with respect and dignity and needs satisfactory resolution to the problem. I full confidence in this guy and I am sure that he will not let it go and will support her properly.

I probably won't be involved from this point on, but I am sure my friend will let me know the outcome, and of course I will let you all know what that is.

I really do appreciate everyone's input on this thread, it is such a shame I couldn't give due credit to board when talking to the sister, imagine what would happen if I said, "the aposates on JWN reckon this is the course you should take........."

Never mind, she seems really sweet and I hope she gets this sorted ASAP. Of course in the longer term, I hope she see the cult for what it is and gets the hell out of there.

Billy the Ex-Bethelite

Firstly, I blame Jehovah. However...

Br. Rex Karz shouldn't have driven her car, particularly in a tight spot next to other vehicles. I'm guessing he drives a rust-bucket with plenty of scratches.

She shouldn't have given him the keys to let him drive her car. She should have stuck to her guns about having the other cars moved.

They should split the cost of repairs.

Let this be a lesson to both of them that Jehovah IS NOT INSURED, will not help anyone, and cannot be held liable. JG was in the KH bathroom taking a crap at the time of the accident.

Georgiegirl

One of the saddest things about all of this is that I suspect she didn't feel she had the right to tell him No - what with him being a Man and an Elder. So the victim will get blamed for allowing this to happen when I doubt she would have had the emotional wherewithal to say No.

Mary

If you're still in touch with this sister, here's an excellent quote from the Watchtower that she could use in her defense:

March 1, 1963 Watchtower p. 160 Questions from Readers:

Q: In the case of an accident involving dedicated Christians, would it be proper for one to enter a legal suit against a fellow Christian in order to claim the benefits of insurance that he has?-E. G., United States.
A: If this is the only means by which the one who sustained injury can get the compensation provided by the insurance, it would not be improper; it is up to him to decide whether he wants to take the matter to court or not. This is not the type of situation that the apostle Paul was discussing when he wrote about law suits, as recorded in 1 Corinthians 6:1-8. He was discussing instances in which persons who claimed to be Christian brothers were at odds with each other. The one felt that he had been defrauded by the other. But the apostle wisely showed that Christians ought to be able to settle matters privately, if not directly between the individuals concerned, then with the aid of other mature ones in the congregation.
However, when there is no such animosity between members of the congregation and the legal suit is simply a procedural arrangement required in order to obtain compensation from the insurance company, the situation is quite different. The course to be taken becomes a matter for personal decision.

cantleave

Thanks Mary - Excellent quote.

flipper

CANTLEAVE- I'm glad your friend is taking it to the elder himself first. Then involve other elders secondly if that doesan't work. And if even THAT doesn't work- then if I were her I'd get legal satisfaction and take it to court if she has to.

Look - This is the BIG problem I have not only with elders , but ALL Jehovah's Witnesses- they think they are above the laws of the land and the line of demarcation and reality get blurred to them because they think obeying Jehovah, er, the WT society is more important than obeying the laws of the land. They all need a swift kick in the crotch ! Hope things go well for your friend

cantleave

Flipper, I agree there is a definite us and them mentality within the organisation. The R&F feel they are better than worldly people. The pioneers and Elders feel they are better than the R&F. The CO's and DO's are better than the Elders and the GB are gods offical spokesmen so they are better than everyone (in fact they are on Par with JC on some matters).

With that attitude from the top down no wonder so many publisher feel worthless and have no self respect.

The Caring Elders

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