The upside of atheism (page 2)

beksbks

But atheism is disbelief. If we hadn't been pressured and molded from birth to believe in god, it wouldn't be such a big deal to acknowledge that we don't believe. Do you have to have faith to believe that the tooth fairy does not exist? If someone tells you there is a rock in front of you, and you know there is no rock, do you have to have faith not to believe that rock is there? It just isn't, and you know it. End of story. If the other guy wants to believe it's there, and walk around that spot for the rest of his life, so be it.

beksbks

Since we're just "choosing" these unprovable beliefs,

Ahh but I don't think we can choose beliefs. Either you believe or you don't. If you are choosing, then it's not actually belief.

paul from cleveland

But atheism is disbelief.

To me agnosticism is disbelief. Atheism seems to be faith in something unknowable.

zoiks

They both require a certain amount of "suspension of disbelief".

Paul, I must take issue with this statement. Perhaps atheism as a stance is subject to a measure of this, perhaps not. But simply not being convinced of any god's existence is certainly not "suspension of disbelief". My personal view is that gods have been used to explain a great many things throughout human history. But they are increasingly becoming "a god of the gaps", that is, gaps in our understanding. The more that we understand about the life, the universe, and everything - the need to use "god" to explain things decreases.

It is simply looking at data in an objective way. Are there things that we may never be able to explain? Probably. But an argument from incredulity, i.e. "I don't know how that happened or works so god must have done it" is not intellectually honest, in my opinion.

HintOfLime

I'm not worried, I'm just wondering. Since we're just "choosing" these unprovable beliefs, why not just choose a belief that there is the possibility of a greater consciousness and perhaps there is something good in store?

There are repercussions caused by all beliefs as well.

What if you believe the rapture or armegeddon is going to be here in the next 20 years (sound familiar?). In that case.. global warming, world peace, etc - there is no point in pursuing soulutions to any of mankind's problems. Why take responsibility for our actions here on earth, when god is scheduled to clean up our mess anyway?

So when time just keeps ticking on (like it always has), and God doesn't show up to clean up our mess... the price to pay for that "hope that something good is in store" just keeps climing higher and higher.

- Lime

paul from cleveland

I guess I'm just saying that I don't understand how anyone can say anything other than "I don't know for sure" and remain intellectually honest.

HintOfLime

To me agnosticism is disbelief. Atheism seems to be faith in something unknowable.

Theism addresses the issue of belief. For any claim asserting the existence of a god, a theist is an individual who accepts (or positively believes) that the claim is true and an atheist (literally, "one without theism") is someone who does not.

Gnosticism (in the general sense being discussed here) addresses the issue of what one knows or claims to know. For any claim regarding the existence of a god, a gnostic is an individual who claims knowledge that the assertion is true and an agnostic (literally, "one who lacks knowledge") is someone who makes no such claim.

	Agnostic	Gnostic
Atheist	1. Agnostic atheist does not believe any god exists, but doesn't claim to know that no god exists	2. Gnostic atheist believes that no god exists and claims to know that this belief is true
Theist	3. Agnostic theist believes a god exists, but doesn't claim to know that this belief is true	4. Gnostic theist believes a god exists and claims to know that this belief is true

zoiks

I guess I'm just saying that I don't understand how anyone can say anything other than "I don't know for sure".

I know where you're coming from, believe me. Some folks are perfectly ok with saying, "I don't know". For others, that just isn't acceptable. Personally, I am coming to terms with not knowing, and being ok with that. I second Jeff's sentiments - I hope that you will find your own beliefs and be ok with them. It is a heavy responsibility as well as an exciting time of self-discovery that we go through when we leave the WT, but it is uniquely OURS.

Peace.

paul from cleveland

Thanks HintofLime. Okay I guess I'm saying that I don't know how anyone can be a Gnostic atheist and remain intellectually honest.

paul from cleveland

Or I should say I don't understand... but I want to.

The upside of atheism

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