Who’s smarter, Catholics or J.W.’s?

by wheelwithinwheel 26 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  leec

  I don't usualy find myself saying good things about RCism, but they traditionally run one of the best private alternatives to public school from kindergardten through high school, to the extent that a number of non-catholic parents send their kids to private catholic schools where they are the best option in their local area. I don't think the same can be said about JW. They run a fair number of very good universities as well. (Though I have no idea and very much wonder what goes on in biotechnology labs in these universites though, like, when it comes to stem cell research and so on. It's probably the case that they just don't "offer" those particular courses of study.)

  That said, Catholics generally don't know much about the actual contents of the bible though, unless they are really hardcore like my father, attending mass 7 days per week, eating sleeping and breathing religion. (I cannot get through a phone call with him without anywhere from 30 mins to several hours devoted to a rambling monologue about what he saw on EWTN, or how I should go to church even if I don't want to, or, when confronted by me about the issue, how the catholic church abhors child abuse as evidenced by the measures taken against all the priests and bishops found guilty of the terrible sin (pretty much the same mix of denial and displayed digust the JWs react with). All my years growing up as a catholic the bible was just a curiosity that gave me a headache when I tried to read it. There was never an emphasis on the exact wording in the bible -- not even in religious study. The teachings were always about the meanings behind the words, not the precise words themselves.
• 

  darnkid

  mama1119: I left the witness organization about 10 years ago. Four years ago I took RCIA classes and was baptized catholic. I don't dwell on the infallibility of the pope or the logic (or not) of the trinity. What I have come away with is a personal relationship with God. As a witness I always believed God was out there, up in heaven. Then why did Jesus say "I am always with you". I now have a relationship with God that I never had in 30 some years as a witness. To know he is real and right here with me at all times is amazing.
• 

  bluesapphire

  Actually, Catholics don't believe the Pope is infallible. They know he is a man and sins, etc. What they believe is that ONLY when the Pope speaks ex cathedra he is speaking under God's authority. And this has only been used a handful of times.

  Catholics are taught to use their brains and it is not a sin to question.

  The RCC has come a long way.

  I think the RCC's main problem (for me) is that they are not culturally relevant. It's like they are in a time warp with all their uniforms, disciplines and even liturgy. They would be a lot more attractive if they updated. But, on the other hand, they are increasing in numbers significantly so they must be doing something right.
• 

  BurnTheShips

  Though I have no idea and very much wonder what goes on in biotechnology labs in these universites though, like, when it comes to stem cell research and so on. It's probably the case that they just don't "offer" those particular courses of study.

  A friend of mine is a researcher at America's newest Catholic University: Ave Maria. He attends my parish, and along with his wife takes care of the coffee and doughnuts we enjoy after Mass.

  He is a yeast biologist. It's not so much the yeast that matters, it is that yeast is so useful for studying genetics. The yeast genome is quite small and simple compared to others. This makes it an excellent organism for genetic research. Yeast researchers have made great inroads into studying cancers. A few years ago, a couple of them won the Nobel for it.

  This fellow taught the RCIA class I attended when the subject matter dealt with evolution. He explained the subject very well, and has no disagreement with biological evolution. I happen to think the same way.

  There is good biotech research going on in Catholic institutions of higher learning. This includes stem cells, just not embryonic stem cells.

  , Catholics don't believe the Pope is infallible. They know he is a man and sins, etc. What they believe is that ONLY when the Pope speaks ex cathedra he is speaking under God's authority. And this has only been used a handful of times.

  What BlueSapphire said. To my knowledge, infallibility has only been invoked twice. The man can be fallible, but the office is protected. Peter was the first Pope, and he was a very fallible man.

  Incidentally, I received baptism last year.

  I think the RCC's main problem (for me) is that they are not culturally relevant. It's like they are in a time warp with all their uniforms, disciplines and even liturgy. They would be a lot more attractive if they updated. But, on the other hand, they are increasing in numbers significantly so they must be doing something right.

  I go to a relatively modern parish. Others are much more modern however. I have to say, I like the old ways best. I like tradition. I like the garb, the liturgy, and the symbols, the ritual, the sacred space. After the sensual desert of JWism, my senses desire it.

  The fact that BlueSapphire and I can argue and disagree on so many things and still be Catholic brothers and sisters at the end of the day speaks volumes about the superiority of Catholicism over JWism.

  The intellectual, spiritual, artistic, and human spaces encompassed by Catholicism are vast. Catholicism is catholic in the true sense. I think there is something here for almost everyone, whether they are BlueSapphire, or BurnTheShips.

  Pax.

  BTS
• 

  AllTimeJeff

  Uh, I always treat people as individuals. And while acknowledging that the Catholic Church has a centuries long record of abuses, that they have since changed and somewhat have tacitly disavowed, this is a no brainer.

  In comparing the groups, the Catholic Church is way smarter. as FS said, they not only allow college, some of the best colleges are Catholic, as well as some of the best high schools.

  If you can deal with liturgical chants, then brains are all over the place. JW's are smart in marketing, smoke and mirrors, and how to use lawyers to defend their gaping moral black hole.
• 

  JWoods

  One thing to remember is that the JWs are secretly very jealous of the RCC, and this is the main reason that they proclaim so much hate for them.

  The RCC does not, to my knowledge, give too much of a hoot what JWs think.

  So that is 1-0 for the Catholics over the Witnesses.
• 

  bluesapphire

  I go to a relatively modern parish. Others are much more modern however. I have to say, I like the old ways best. I like tradition. I like the garb, the liturgy, and the symbols, the ritual, the sacred space. After the sensual desert of JWism, my senses desire it.

  Bingo on the sensual desert comment. I've been going to another church lately and I am feeling it a lot more. I love the sensual stimulation to my nose with the insence and the sound of the Litany of Saints at Easter. But at this other church I'm going to now the talk is usually so much more pertinent to everyday life in the US. My kids enjoy it more. I like the music more. Every now and then I miss communion and the feeling I get from it so I go to a Mass. I really wish we had a more progressive pope. And I no longer feel priestly celibacy is relevant in our culture. It served its purpose now move on.

  With all due respect, Burns, I don't understand how you can be so against Democratic social issues in this country and still be Catholic. The Catholic Church is a socially progressive church. The only issue the Church has (and it's only because the GOP adopted it as their sole property) is against abortion. It seems to me that on every other social issue, the Church is on the Democratic side. I honestly believe if Jesus were on Earth today he would be against Capitalism.
• 

  bluesapphire

  One thing to remember is that the JWs are secretly very jealous of the RCC, and this is the main reason that they proclaim so much hate for them.

  The RCC does not, to my knowledge, give too much of a hoot what JWs think.

  Aint that the truth, Woods!!! I remember when I first reverted back to Catholicism after I left the duds, I thought I had sooooo much of a story to tell and could help Catholics *understand* the JWs so people could help their JW relatives blah blah blah!

  It took me a while to figure out they just don't give a hoot about JWs. They're not even the equivalent of a splinter in their little toe. Sure when someone is affected by them because a family member starts studying and being an idiot with the rest of the fam, then some Catholics are troubled and want to *save* the family member. But even then, if he/she persists, he/she is eventually left alone and viewed as a weirdo. Life goes on. Birthdays, holidays, weddings, funerals, LIFE.

  JW's are so unimportant, irrelevant and almost really invisible to most people.

  Not sure I believe this, but one person's perspective was, "Satan mimics the Church ... JWs mimic the Church."

  If there is a literal Satan, it appears this is true ... to a small degree it's like the Watchtower is so jealous of the Church and they just want to take it over.
• 

  yesidid

  They're both cults.

  A big one and a little one.

  y
• 

  GLTirebiter

  What is the smarter way to do missionary work? Do you take the time to set up schools, orphanages, clinics, and hospitals to see to the human needs, or do you just build the Kingdom Halls (churches) and a Branch Offices (Cathedral), then tell the locals to "wait on jehovah" to feed the children and attend to the sick? Do you try to make a real difference in peoples' lives, or only sign them up to peddle Watchtower Wares to their neighbors?

  The RCC has not been faultless, but their attitude towards charity is a big reason I still respect the Church (and may return some day). Seeing the Watchtower's attitude towards charity is a big reason I will have nothing to do with that organization. Which organization is following the smarter policy?

  GLT