6/15/10 WT - p. 8, par. 12

sd-7

"What else do we learn from the experience of the psalmist? He found security and wisdom among God's people. He started reasoning clearly and logically when he went to the place where Jehovah was worshipped. Similarly today, we can find wise counselors and enjoy wholesome spiritual food at congregation meetings."

This statement seems to harmonize with the sentiments of many, especially when they speak of someone who leaves Jehovah's Witnesses. For example, "Yeah, he went crazy and left the truth." Ever heard that one? Sound, logical reasoning somehow does not exist for anyone who, for reasons often unknown to persons not involved in the situation, gets expelled from the religion.

In the context of this article, where the oft-repeated Asaph story is related, of course I'm not suggesting that wicked people really do fare well in their lives. If we make poor choices, we often end up saddled with the negative consequences. But a person is not necessary lacking in sound reasoning because he has doubts about a particular religion's teachings. Our minds are creative, adaptable, and prone to reassess situations when we are in an uncomfortable place.

Here is an example of sound, logical reasoning, in the same article, paragraph 19:

"Just think what would become of you if you were to abandon the protective environment of the Christian congregation. Many, recalling their futile course of life before they accepted the truth, simply shudder at the thought. (John 6:68, 69) You can continue to find security and protection from the woes and misery so common in Satan's world by staying in close company with your Christian brothers and sisters."

This seems like an honorable statement on its face, but is it appealing to logic or reason, or is it primarily appealing to fear, an emotion? Note also the use of John 6:68, 69. "Lord, whom shall we go away to?" Peter said. Note that this verse is being applied, not to Jesus Christ, but to remaining inside this religion. Is that sound reasoning? Or is it a misuse of the scriptures?

Granted, there are things to fear out here in the world. Our own mistakes can bring problems to our lives, this is a reality. But it is possible to develop sound reasoning without the involvement of this particular group of people. After all, this is the same group that does NOT encourage you to think for yourself, to research using non-Watchtower literature. If anything, such policies stifle sound reasoning by insulating one's belief system from serious scrutiny.

Just a thought. I'm all for trying to live by the Bible, but I'm not for fear masquerading as sound reasoning.

Mad Sweeney

There are only two possible lives, only two possible outomes, to the Dubs.

You will be in the borg and under borg protection forever or you will be in "Satan's world" and doomed to loving, just, destruction "soon."

Setting up "us versus them" bifurcation of the world is a cult mind control tactic. There is no logic, no sound basis for such a limited world view. There are actually around 7 billion (current) possible lives with infinite possible outcomes on this planet, none of which involve a hands-on destruction or salvation via an invisible sky-daddy.

darkl1ght3r

Of course, in JW-lala-land, "sound reasoning" doesn't mean the same thing that it does out here in the real world. For them "sound reasoning" means accepting the silly claims of the "F&DS" and letting the Watchtower do your thinking for you. So it really means the opposite of the dictionary definition.

On that note it really really really pisses me off when they use words like "logic" and "reason" in refrence to themselves.

leavingwt

trying to live by the Bible

In time, you'll probably realize that your personal values are much higher than those found in Scripture.

tec

In time, you'll probably realize that your personal values are much higher than those found in Scripture - LWT.

I think that depends on whether you're taking Jesus at his word or not. I model my values after his teachings.

Tec

zoiks

Wow, the lines in paragraph 19 make me shudder a bit. "Just think what would become of you..." is fear-mongering at its finest.

It feels soooo good to have left that fear behind.

dgp

Leavingwt, I agree .

leavingwt

I think that depends on whether you're taking Jesus at his word or not. I model my values after his teachings.

Jesus said some fine things. The 'Golden Rule' would be the best example.

You may find that some of your personal values came from sources external to Scripture. Here are a few that come to mind.

Slavery is always wrong.
Animals should be treated with diginity.
Women are not property.
Selling all of your worldly posessions is usually not the best way to feed and clothe yourself.
False prophecies are cruel.

sd-7

In time, you'll probably realize that your personal values are much higher than those found in Scripture.

I guess that depends on which scriptures we're talking about. On one hand, I'm not for killing all the men, women and children in a town because a higher power tells me to. I'm not for killing a guy so I can have his hot wife for myself. I'm not for raping a young girl and then buying her as my wife. Those are things I don't agree with, for obvious reasons.

I would say the things Jesus himself taught are the things I'd want to agree with. I don't see anything particularly out of place about his ideals as found in scripture.

But I will add that, without group pressure and constant fear, guilt and shame being piled onto you, it's hard not to feel like I've no sense of direction. It's a huge culture shock and I'm still having trouble trying to get it right.

But I just couldn't go on accepting logic that was anything but sound, once you understand how cults operate. I don't shudder at the possibilities in my future because of being outside of this religion. I only shudder because I'm afraid of the unknown. And because so far...post-cult life has been one giant catastrophe. But let's not get personal again, we know where that leads...

goldensky

Leavingwt, .

6/15/10 WT - p. 8, par. 12

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