by AK - Jeff 17 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Or are the two interconnected?
Just watched a dateline episode that dealt with social conformity in which they duplicated the 50's experiment telling a person to shock another while listening to him scream from the other room. Most of the people involved just kept shocking the other person due to the authority figure in the room telling them to continue.
So, are Jw's under mind control in it's purest form, or just under social conformity pressure? Or both?
Jeff
So, are Jw's under mind control in it's purest form, or just under social conformity pressure? Or both?
Jeff, I think you already know the answer which is why you have include both in your question.
No I don't. At least definitively.
Mind control involves techniques designed to 'steal' the mind from it's rightful owner. Trickery that fools the mind into action that would not be taken if the person was not so influenced.
Social conformity - as demonstrated by the program last nite, can be virtually instantaneous in nature. No chants, no subterfuge designed to control ones mind and actions. Just pressure to conform to the dictates of an authority figure.
I see the two as distinct, and I actually am beginning to shift away from the idea of mind control with Jw's, at least in it's intentional version.
If this was as simple as a yes or no, I would not have posted the question.
Jeff
"Mind control" is a bit of a misnomer. All it really is, is intentionally directed social conformity using psychological techniques. It is NOT brainwashing, which is what most people think of when they hear or see the term.
It isn't 100% control any more than a rider 100% controls his horse. The horse can buck and run off in his own direction but the rider does his damndest to train the horse and make it SO UNPLEASANT TO DO SO that the horse is extremely unlikely to even consider it, let alone do it.
Yeah, the Borg uses mind control. Mind control IS social conformity (as well as authority and other psychosocial phenomena) used in an intentional way to control members of an organization. Mind control isn't brainwashing. It is more insidious and while only moderately effective at recruitment it is VERY effective at retention.
bump
This is a worthy topic, IMO.
Well, in my experience, I think that with social conformity, you have no real urge to conform once you are out of the influence of the group. So once you go home to your own place, you're back to whatever you wish to do or think or feel or say.
Regarding JWs, I'd have to go with mind control because there is no returning to normalcy. The things that were done in my family by my parents when no other JWs were around point more to mind control. They were never like this before they got baptized and became 'zealous' JWs. They accused their children of doing illegal and bad things without a shred of evidence. My Dad tried to be 'the head' in my adult brother's household. Only JWs are right and have the Truth doncha know. It is only after my parents became immersed in the BS that this happened and it tore our family apart.
They know all about how the social conformity works, though, and use it to their advantage. Look up the Ashe Social Conformity study on youtube and you will see that even with JUST ONE nonconformist allowed to speak an alternate view, almost ALL conformity is out the window. THAT is why they are so strict about NOT SPEAKING with ANYone who disagrees with Dub doctrine or the Borg in any way. They KNOW they use social conformity as one (just one of many) of their mind control tools.
It is mind control.
Social conformity is for high school cheerleaders compared to these goons.
Both.
Examples of mind control: phobia indoctrination (fear of "the world", apostates etc; thought reform (constant admonition regarding how we "view things") and information control (demonization of internet - literally, criticism of outside research).
Examples of social conformity: behaviour and emotional control through group dynamics.
Professor Milgram's experiment sought to explain why ordinary people had performed such dreadful acts during the war. He demonstrated that all is required is an authority figure and because people are taught to defer to figures in authority they will do things that go against their conscience if the person in charge tells them to. However the people in the original experiment did not always comply with the instruction to shock the other participant and some of the people were also profoundly disturbed by what they believed they had done. Even when they discovered that the other person was an actor and had suffered no shocks they were still extremely upset by the experience.
This is different to the congregation set up where rather than deference to a person in authority people conform because of peer pressure from within the group. The governing body serves as the rationale behind the rules to shun but in general people don't shun because of them. People are isolated because other members of the group do this and loyalty to the group is demonstrated by isolating non conformists.
The congregation is a complex high control group which operates on both a social and mental level. The congregation are sheep like in that they do not question the rules even though they are inimical to health and well being of others. Even when there is no real cause for excluding people JWs will still make choices about who is a good associate and who isn't based on how closely an individual actually follows the rules that identify them as a member of the group. They do not require an authority figure to point out those that are not sheep like the social control allows them to do this with little thought or effort. A close friend of mine who is a JW and who attended family Christmases and social events and whose meeting attendance and Field service was sporadic has not spoken to me or telephoned in months. She has chosen to shun because I am following a different course to her. Social control skillfully applied is a powerful tool.
