Is it mind control or just strong social conformity?

by AK - Jeff 17 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    JW's fit Steve Hassan's BITE method of control. But they don't strap you to a chair with your eyelids pryed wide open and fill your head with images or propaganda. It's quite slow and deliberate through meetings and literature. Social conformity is a huge part of it. Your mind is conditioned to think they have the truth then you start "fitting in" with the JW's. Next thing you might know, you are decrying "Persecution" when Grandma tries to force life-saving blood on your daughter.

    But even the experts battle back and forth on this. "If we call JW's a cult, then isn't all religion like that, or A.A.?" I fully agree with Mad Sweeney's first post here. The average person thinks of deliberate brainwashing when they hear "cult" and "mind-control." I use the terms to fully let it sink in to others that I was there and I am sure that they are a huge danger to their members (and society to a degree). But you can call it whatever you like: high control group with strong social conformity, or dangerous mind-control cult. They still attempt to control the lives of the members and the way they think and act.

  • cult classic
    cult classic

    I don't think you can separate the two. When you take out the spooky connotations of brain washing and mind control it's all the same thing. And social conformity is a matter of degrees. Every group exhibits it and it's not necessarily bad. I'm with OTWO, I don't care what you call it, it's wrong and the end result is the same.

    Cult Classic

  • flipper
    flipper

    It's mind control in it's purest form. Just look at the WT leaders track record

  • aSphereisnotaCircle
    aSphereisnotaCircle

    It isn't 100% control any more than a rider 100% controls his horse. The horse can buck and run off in his own direction but the rider does his damndest to train the horse and make it SO UNPLEASANT TO DO SO that the horse is extremely unlikely to even consider it, let alone do it.

    Excellant point, the mind control is never 100% in any group.

    And I love the analogy. I get frustrated with people that say "If they want to be part of that religion, it's their choice, they coul leave at any time!"

    It's not their choice, they never have a choice.

  • sabastious
    sabastious

    It's blackmail really.

    You get in, not fully understanding the gravity of the commitment. Once you want out, it is available, at a price.

    -Sab

  • cult classic
    cult classic

    I like that sabastious - blackmail

    good points you guys

    Cult Classic

  • flipper
    flipper

    Yes, I agree with SABASTIOUS, it's mind control and blackmail all at the same time- both

  • mindmelda
    mindmelda

    Social conformity is a form of mind control. It doesn't require waterboarding to get someone to do things against their usual inclination, just some good old peer pressure will do.

    Remember high school? Remember how miserable you were sometimes? That was social conformity working on you. When you never felt good enough, smart enough, or good looking enough.

    The B-Org is a lot like that...only they play with more loaded dice.

    I also think the degree of "mind control" varies from person to person. There's an old saying among con artist that you can only con a person as long as they want what they think you're offering. People who want certain things are going to want what the Witnesses have to offer, and the degree to which they want it determines their depth of involvement.

    Oh, it's nothing bad, it's just that it's just stuff no one can give you...you have to find it yourself, within yourself. Even God can't give what the Witnesses promise, which is utopian BS that was never really a utopia anyway. You do all know that word is ironic in usage, don't you?

    It means, "not a place" which means that utopian societies look much better on paper than they do in reality, and are allegorical, not literal. Since humans don't behave ideally, how can one have an ideal society without fundamentally changing human nature itself? We'd have to totally eliminate individual desire and need to have a totally peaceful, unified and organized society.

    Give me some good old human chaos any old day over that fantasy!

    Life is dirty, messy and complicated, deal with it. See, that's what I really hate about the Witnesses. They're afraid of real life, so they invent a fantasy existence and call it "the spiritual paradise" but it's really a training camp for how to live in denial of the real, messy and screwed up human world that we all have to learn to live in.

    That's why they attract people with poor coping skills, like me. I had really crappy coping skills and they took away the few I had and replaced them with something even worse...believing in total brain turds.

    Finding out the real world is do-able and that I can really cope with it while working with a therapist helped me conquer anxiety and depression more than 34 years of fairy tales and avoiding reality.

    In fact, I think it was a big cause of it. Denial, there's a mind killer.

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