Post Resurection for the bored Fundies

by unclebruce 23 Replies latest jw friends

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  You Know

  Will Power asks:

  "Jehovah's grand purpose" Isn't this the whole reason for becoming a witness dedicated to the organization in brooklyn?

  That's a bit of a distortion. We are not solely dedicated to an organization, but rather to a cause. The organization is itself dedicated to Jehovah's cause and plays a vital part in the outworking of God's purpose.

  The grand purpose was to have the garden of eden upon the whole earth forever and they are the ones that offer this?

  That is certainly part of God's purpose, it is also Jehovah's will to adopt a relatively small number of humans so that they become spiritual sons and daughters and make up a New Creation superior to even cherubs and seraphs and angels. While on the earth these chosen children of God are primarily involved in extending Jehovah's invitation to others to live on earth in paradise. Revelation foretells their activity where it says: "And the spirit and the bride keep on saying: "Come!...Let anyone that wishes take life's water free."

  Did God know that Adam and Eve would sin? Was the entire history of mankind devised the instant the original sin was committed? Sort of plan B scenario?

  Jehovah made humans and angels with free will, so He was certainly aware that they had options and alternatives to doing his will. And without a doubt he could have had well in mind any contingencies in case his creatures misused their free will. I think the more intriguing question would be, Did Satan foresee the masterful way that God would be able to deal with his challenge? That's the much more intriguing question. Because here you have this powerful and intelligent angelic son of God who stood before the great God Jehovah in heaven for you knows how many eons, and he comes up with this scheme that he imagines may embarrass God and put him in a corner. Think about it, Here Jehovah states that it is his will that Adam and Eve fill the earth with their offspring, but yet they are condemned to death. Not only that, Jehovah declared that he was resting so he would be a liar if he had to go back and recreate two more "perfect" humans and hope that they will obey him. So either way it would make God a liar. If God would have let Adam off the hook God would have been a liar, because he already said, "You will positively die." And if God puts them to death or even allows them to procreate and produce a dying race, as was the case, God is still a liar, because when he said, "fill the earth" it is understood that he wanted perfect humans to fill the earth.

  Hebrews the 1st chapter indicates that God's mandate to subdue the earth was not fulfilled, and cannot be fulfilled with imperfect humans. So Satan certainly thought that he had God maneuvered into an impossible situation whereby Jehovah would have to acknowledge that Satan bested him and God would simply have to move on and let Satan have his little kingdom over us. When God came out with his prophecy at Genesis 3:15 it appears that it was something that the Devil had not anticipated. Jehovah's grand purpose in Christ is nothing short of magnificent. God doesn't violate his Sabbath by creating a new man to replace Adam, since Jesus already existed in the spirit realm, and God's purpose to have the earth filled with a perfect race will come about through the redemption of the degenerate race made possible by Jesus' sacrificial death. No human could have thought up such a wonderful thing as that and apparently no angel could have foreseen God's solution either. That’s why the angels are spoken of a stooping down to peer at God’s activity in connection with the seed of his women. The whole story has not actually unfolded yet, but it has already been told. / You Know
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  You Know

  Jello Mold:

  Read the Hebrew scriptures, and you will find little mention of an antithesis to God. The ancient Israelites attributed everything good, as well as everything bad, to GOD.

  When God issued the prophecy at Genesis 3:15 he did not immediately explain himself. In connection with the seed of the women it was in fact what is called in Scripture--"a sacred secret." For several thousand years it was not at all clear who or what the seed of the women was. However, when Jesus came on the scene as the promised Messiah then it became Jehovah's will to fully reveal the players in the game. When Jesus told the murdering Jews that they were from their father the Devil and that the 'Devil was a manslayer when he began,' Jesus was indicating that the Devil began his course of opposition to God in the garden of Eden when he misled Adam and Eve to their deaths. So it was appropriate that Jesus, as the seed of the woman, would have the priviledge of unmasking the serpent as being the diabolical ruler of the world---Satan the Devil.

  The serpent, if you read Genesis carefully, was just a serpent. God said 'crawl on your belly and eat dust'. He was NOT talking to an angelic creature later to be named Satan.

  LOL. What makes you think I haven't read it carefully? LOL Do you know what a metaphor is? If you knew a little bit about how God thinks you would know. In the prophets from Isaiah through Malachi Jehovah uses literally hundreds of illustrations and symbolisms. It is simple minded to say that God meant his enigmatic expressions to be taken literally. Since the Devil had pretended to actually be a serpent when he spoke to Eve, Jehovah merely went along with the game and spoke to the serpent. God's telling the serpent he would eat dust was Jehovah's judicial sentencing of Satan to be an outcast from God's family. Basically God disfellowshipped the Devil and banished him AS IF he were an actual serpent to a lowly position relative to his glorious place that he had previously occupied.

  In addition, the bible is now being disseminated because of oral tradition. Would you independently come to the conclusion that the bible was the work of a Supreme God, not having parents or religion to impress that upon you?

  My parents didn't teach me about the Bible. I had no religious training to speak of. I was dropping acid and shooting heroin when you were sitting in the kindom hall drawing in your coloring book.

  / You Know
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  Will Power

  You know you wrote:
  No human could have thought up such a wonderful thing as that and apparently no angel could have foreseen God's solution either.

  Someone wrote so much about how it must have been that they even believe they have got inside God's mind, know his feelings, his purpose for being. When they have their little spats up there is that really the thunder we hear?

  and this:
  Did Satan foresee the masterful way that God would be able to deal with his challenge? That's the much more intriguing question. Because here you have this powerful and intelligent angelic son of God who stood before the great God Jehovah in heaven for you knows how many eons, and he comes up with this scheme that he imagines may embarrass God and put him in a corner.

  Why do you call God's sonS angels? Like he is the big Angel Senior? and the only description of the devil - abaddon is in revelation with 5 eyes & 10 horns coming out of the abyss.

  Incidently the 144,000 can only be virgins who have not defiled themselves with women. I think ALL jw women everywhere should withhold their services forever, lest they defile their man.
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  cellomould

  You Know,

  I am sorry to hear about that. It must have been a painful period in your life. Glad that you are still around to live and breathe!

  I understand what you are saying about metaphor. I don't want to 'take away God's right to use metaphor' but simply show how other belief systms have similar poweful metaphoric value. There is no need to criminalize people who worship a different God in a different way.

  It will always be up for debate which ideology is superior.

  But does it make your quality of life right now better than theirs? And even if it does, who is really counting? What good is the knowledge that you are happier than someone else? If anything, it prevents you from relaxing and enjoying your life.

  Perhaps you have found a place where 'the air is sweet'. Enjoy it!

  jellomold

  "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke