Are there any scholars in the society?

sleepy

I was having quite an intense disscussion (ok, argument )with some of my family last weekend.
My brother said in answer to some points that I raised , that the society has scholars who do research and will have the answer to my questions.
I said I know of no sholars in the society, he said thats because the world does not recognise them as such.What I ment (but did not continue saying as the conversation changed direction , again) was that the people who do research and study for the society arent really scholars as they are not free to look for the real truth only to confirm what the society says.Their skills are really knowledge of the societies beliefs.
Well it is true that a scholar is just someone who has a great knowledge of a particular subject.So you could argue that the society does have scholars as they are people with great knowledge of the organistaions rules .But what must people would mean my scholars are people who put a great deal of time and effort into research and study of an issue as to whether it is true or false, real or make believe.
Can the society have scholars in that sense?
Well a recent watchtower article stated that we could not even have private opinions on Bibles matters.
In order to research whether a certain witness view point was valid or not you would have to entertain the idea that a certain viewpoint could be wrong. But this would put you at odds with the society , as you cannot think differently even privately your own opinions on bible matters. So how would a so called scholar actually be able to do any meaningful research?
If they were being loyal to the organisation all they could do is find evidence of things that suite the societies beliefs.
Doing so would lead them to only research with the goal of supporting the organisations beliefs.
They would look for quotes and evidence that seams to support the society, maybe ignoring the rest and not making known the fact that there is contery evidence.
Is this not what has happened?
The society constantly quotes people who can lend weight to there own beliefs , takes others out of context , and never lets you know of contery evidence.
Even Ray Franz when doing research that idicated the society was wrong about 607 whent ahead and published the view that it was the correct date out of loyalty to the society.
As long as witness have the idea that loyalty is above truth they will never dig themselves out of the hole they are in.
If there are serious scholars within the org they will have to have the ability to disagre other wise they are just propagandaists.
Just like Hitlers best men they indoctrinate others into a belief system that presents itself as reasonable and open by twisting the facts to suite them.
There are no true scholars in the society.

ozziepost

There are no true scholars in the society.

That's quite a broad statement! In some respects we don't know if there are or not.

Do you remember the time when elders wrote their own talks? True, it seems a long time ago but think of how different is the situation in the recent decades. ALL TALKS ARE OUTLINES OR MANUSCRIPTS provided by the WTS. The result of this is that even if an elder were a learned Bible scholar, we would never know. We certainly wouldn't get the benefit of his scholarship. Everything must be provided by the F&DS i.e. the WTS heirarchy.

Brothers are trained in the delivery of talks, not in the research and authorship of them. At best, all we can say about elders delivering talks, is that some are able to speak from someone else's notes very well!

Cheers,
Ozzie

"It's better to light a candle than to curse the darkness."
Anonymous

freeman

Does the society have scholars?

If your question is to be understood in the ordinary sense that the ‘man on the street’ would understand, the answer is likely no.

The man on the street would not only understand it to mean a person well versed in the subject matter, but also someone ‘well lettered’, that is to say someone in possession of an advanced degree in this field. Since the society has a history of strongly discouraging higher education, and the fact that it is impossible for anyone with in-depth Biblical knowledge to support many of the society’s positions without employing copious amounts of mental gymnastics, the logical answer to your question is no, or very unlikely.

Freeman

JT

freeman says:

the fact that it is impossible for anyone with in-depth Biblical knowledge to support many of the society’s positions without employing copious amounts of mental gymnastics, the logical answer to your question is no, or very unlikely.
_____________

i love the way you put it GYMNASTICS----

NotBlind

Are there any scholars in the WT organization? I'm sure you mean BIBLE or RELIGIOUS scholars. Of course, if there are any at all, there are not many, and they do not have the scholarly freedom to research or discuss doctrine that REAL religious scholars have.

On the other hand, there are many scholars in other field in the WT, or at least those who nominally claim to be JW's. For example, I am working on a Ph.D. in chemistry and perform research in my desired field. I consider myself a scholar (but not a Bible scholar).

But again, are there any Bible scholars in the society? Not really.

drahcir yarrum

NO!

"Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life son." Dean Vernon Wormer, Faber College

IslandWoman

Sleepy,

Just as there was a Raymond Franz and a Br. Dunlap at Bethel years ago, there are brothers there now who "know" and who are working and waiting for the day when God will take retribution against the Org. for all the pain and damage it has caused. They will be there to pick up the "pieces".

Please do not discount them.

IW

drahcir yarrum

IslandWoman:

While I have great admiration for Ray Franz and Dunlap, I don't think either of them considered themselves to be scholars, nor were they
recognized as such by academia. I think obviously they are very bright men, but the term scholar denotes an achievement of expertise and letters in a particular field. The WTS so bastardizes the orginal Bible texts in order to support their doctrines, that no "scholar" would dare be associated with them.

Perhaps you are correct about some well meaning, bright people waiting at HQ for an opportunity to set the ship aright, but a really smart person, knowing the truth about the WTS would most likely leave and either join another group of likeminded people or form his/her own group of likeminded people.

"Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life son." Dean Vernon Wormer, Faber College

outnfree

Sleepy,

Have you considered writing a letter to the Society asking them the points you raised here [only speaking with tongue-partly-in-cheek]?

Well, it is true that a scholar is just someone who has a great knowledge of a particular subject.So you could argue that the society does have scholars as they are people with great knowledge of the organistaions rules .But what must people would mean my scholars are people who put a great deal of time and effort into research and study of an issue as to whether it is true or false, real or make believe.
Can the society have scholars in that sense?
Well a recent watchtower article stated that we could not even have private opinions on Bibles matters.
In order to research whether a certain witness view point was valid or not you would have to entertain the idea that a certain viewpoint could be wrong. But this would put you at odds with the society , as you cannot think differently even privately your own opinions on bible matters. So how would a so called scholar actually be able to do any meaningful research?

It seems to me that an inquiring JW might want to know how s/he reconciles not having independent thoughts with independent inquiry on Bible-related subjects. Up until that recent article, even GOOD JW's would feel it perfectly okay to consult worldly Bible reference works (including commentaries) for information. Are they still permitted to do so, as some of those materials have information which conflicts with the Society's view? If not, how is it that the Bethel writing department is allowed to consult such works? Or ARE they?

Yes, yes, it would be interesting to know the Society's take on this...

outnfree

It's what you learn after you know it all that counts -- John Wooden

IslandWoman

drahcir yarrum,

You said, "a really smart person, knowing the truth about the WTS would most likely leave and either join another group of likeminded people or form his/her own group of likeminded people."

There are "really smart" people there who for good reasons have chosen to stay and they will be there when the GB breaks.

The "mountain" WILL come to "Mohammed"!

IW

Are there any scholars in the society?

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