Shelby
Greetings dear Fester… and may you have peace, truly! I will respond and answer all that I can and am able to, as I know it and/or am permitted by my Lord, the Holy One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH… by means of the holy spirit he has granted me. If I know, I will state that. If not, I will state that, as well.
I appreciate all that you stated here, but the cold hard facts are quite simple, the biblical format is one mainly taken from the Mithras concerning the character in the story called "Jesus".
Oh… my… gosh. You are NOT going to believe this. As I said elsewhere, there is a REASON for EVERYTHING, dear one. Okay… let me explain: a VERY funny thing “happened” to me and my husband (and our grandson) “on the way” to the Egyptian museum in San Jose (which is fabulous, BTW!) last weekend. The museum was having a presentation in their planetarium, which is operated by the Rosecrucians. Now, I had no idea who/what the Rosecrucians were (and still don’t know very much), but this particular presentation was titled, you guessed it, “THE ORIGINS OF THE MITHRAIC MYSTERIES.” I kid you NOT.
Now, I don’t usually “go” for… ummmm… I dunno, religious stuff… let along esoteric religious stuff – I mean, if you’re TRULY connected to God, what in the WORLD is there to hide… and why within some “mysterious” group?? I’m all about the Light, so I don’t usually go there.
BUT… I LOVE planetariums… and this presentation turned out to be fascinating.
Without going into great detail (you can read the book or see the presentation yourself), I will say that it was all ABOUT the Mithras… and ABSOLUTELY debunked the various “theories” behind their beliefs.
But here’s the REAL thing: while I DO love information re the constellations, etc., I have NO desire to learn anything about a religion. Yet, I was not compelled to leave, but to the contrary to stay. And so I did. But, why in the WORLD would I, foolish thing that I am, have occasion to see a presentation about the myths, mysteries, beliefs, and practices of the Mithras? Who the…. What the…??? But now I know: to be able to respond to YOU, dear one, regarding your statement above. And that response is:
The Mithras did not worship ANY god. Indeed, they didn’t worship a god at all… or follow one. They ‘worshipped’… and followed… the stars. They were… astrologers… and very GOOD ones, at that. Their symbol (i.e., the hunter, bull, men with torches up/down, the dog, etc.)… are references to constellations (i.e., Perseus, Taurus, Canis Minor, and more). However, they existed during a time when PROFESSING to know the constellations… and their movement… could have cost them their lives. For they all lived among superstitious people that worshipped false gods… and considered such things as “magic practicing” and anathema. So, in order to cover their TRUE purpose (astrology)… they simply claimed to follow a god that they didn’t even belief existed. “Mithra”… was merely a code… and a cover.
But… you don’t have to believe me. You can read the truth about this matter yourself in the publications of Dr. Davis Ulansey. Please note, that Dr. Ulansey PROVES… that “Mithras”… is the constellation, “Perseus.” His revelation is accurate and logical… and the presentation my family and I saw was… well, fascinating.
I digress…
We have absolutely no historical documents proving the existence of Jesus.
Okay, wait. Are not the writings of John, Matthew, Mark (Peter’s son), Paul, Silvanus, James and Jude (who were my Lord’s brothers in the flesh)… Thomas, Barnabas, Mary the Magdelene, and others, “historical documents”? If not, what are they? Okay, okay, let’s say they’re not. What of LUKE’S writings? I mean, he was HIRED to write regarding my Lord’s existence… by Theophilus… and interviewed people who had been “eyewitnesses.” If we aren’t to lend SOME credence to what he wrote, then how can we lend ANY credence to ANYTHING written by ANY historian? What is the criteria? What, their credentials?
We have no proof of authorship of any of the gospels. We have no credible contemporary historian to ever once mention Jesus in any historical document in the first century. So, the writer identifying himself is not “proof”? So, if no one here corroborates that you and I have written to one another in, say, 500 years… we did not? How, then, can we accept ANY writing… for example, that of Socrates? HE was a slave of Christ (didn’t know that, did’ya? – but he was. And he was put to death for it. Well, yes, he drank the hemlock tea, but it was either that... or die at the hands of earthling man. Which would YOU choose?)
Now, concerning the story of the bible itself, aside from no historical evidence of the existence of Jesus, let's assume that your Lord is real and does exist.
Okay, let’s…
You commented on how he didn't come to bring peace and unite fathers with sons, mothers with daughters, correct?
Yes…
You stated that his coming was going to definitely bring division among family, correct?
Yes…
If his coming wasn't to bring peace among all family members, than how does he actually fit the role of Messiah?
I would LOVE to respond, but I am not sure what you are asking. Which part of that “role” are you referring to?
Moreover, how does any of this "I'm not here to bring peace but division among families" fit with Paul's words in Ephesians Chapter 2 where he said "He came preaching peace and breaking down the dividing wall of hostility"?
Because Paul was not speaking of peace within Israelite families… but peace between Israel and the nations. The “wall of hostility”… was the Law Covenant, which separated the two. But Paul didn’t leave us wondering. He explained that:
“But now in union with Christ [Jesus] YOU who were once faroff have come to benear… by the blood of the Christ.For heis our peace, he who made the two parties one and destroyed the wall in between that fenced them off. By means of his flesh he abolished the enmity, the Lawof commandments consisting in decrees, that he might create the two peoples in union with himself into one new man and make peace; a nd that he might fully reconcile both peoples in one body… to God through the torture stake, becausehe had killed off the enmity by means of himself. And he came and declared the good news of peace to YOU , the ones far off, and peace to those near, because through him we, both peoples, have the approach to the Father by one spirit . Certainly, therefore, YOU are no longer strangers and alien residents, but YOU are fellow citizens of the holy ones and are members of the household of God, and YOU have been built up upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, while Christ Jesus himself is the foundation cornerstone. In union with him … the whole building, being harmoniously joined together, is growing into a holy temple for JaHVeH. I n union with him YOU … too … are being built uptogether… into a place for God to inhabit by spirit. ”
Malachi 4:6 tells us that the Moshiach(s) are always supposed to unite people, family, Israel, etc. The goal of the Moshiach is to reunite the two houses of Israel/Judah, not divide!
Let’s look at that first, shall we? It states:
And he must turn the heart of fathers back toward sons, and the heart of sons back toward fathers; in order that I may not come and actually strike the earth with a devoting [of it] to destruction.”
WHICH fathers would he turn back, dear one? And which sons? I PROMISE you that there are those HERE… and all over… who WOULD have turned AGAINST their fathers/sons… but for my Lord. But… because of HIS love… which love he has taught THEM… they have turned their hearts BACK. (For some reason, I SO want to say right now, ‘Can I get a witness?’ – LOLOLOLOL!)
Another question for you though: How does Isaiah 7:14 end up in Matthew? Doesn't Isaiah 7:14 strictly deal with Isaiah's son in Isaiah 8:3?
No, dear one. Isaiah 7:14 prophesies about my Lord. And… debunks that whole false teaching… the LIE… that he was created/born “perfect”… in the flesh. He was not. He not only had to LEARN to choose the good from the bad… but he was sent… in the “likeness” of sinFUL flesh (i.e., flesh FULL of sin… and thus, death)… NOT sinLESS flesh… as many falsely teach. Romans 8:3
If he KNEW to choose the good over the bad from the very moment of his birth, then how is it that he was tested… LIKE US… in ALL respects? Wouldn’t that have given him an advantage? And if his flesh was sinLESS… how did it carry sin IN it (by means of the sickness and death IN it)? And we KNOW it did… because (1) it was prophesied (Isaiah 53:3-5)… and (2) he said to those in the synagogue:
“No doubt YOU will apply this illustration to me, ‘Physician, cure yourself; the things we heard as having happened in Ca·per´na·um do also here in your home territory.’” Luke 4:23
Now, many will say, indeed, you may have heard the WTBTS teach, “Well, he was talking about “healing” those who were sick in Nazareth … as he healed in those in Capernaum. (Matthew 4:23) But they OVERLOOK his statement as to their question regarding HIMSELF: “No doubt you will apply this illustration to me, ‘Physician… CUREYOURSELF.”
Why would say such a thing? Why would he need to cure himself? Because… he carried the sins of those he healed… IN HIS FLESH. That is what Isaiah was speaking about:
“He was despised and was avoided by men, a man meant for pains and for having acquaintance with sickness. And there was as if the concealing of one’s face from us. He was despised, and we held him as of no account.Truly our sicknesses were what he himself carried; and as for our pains, he bore them. But weourselves accounted him as plagued, stricken by God and afflicted.”
What does this mean? It means, dear one, that when my Lord healed someone… he did so… by taking THEIR sickness/affliction… into HIS flesh. And took all of that with him to the grave. Indeed, he was SO disfigured… NOT by the lashings he received… but by the MANY diseases and infirmities he took into HIS flesh (he traded his CLEAN spirit… for such “uncleanness”)…that when they came to arrest him, they fell away… in horror and disgust. And Isaiah had prophesied that they would do that:
“Turn away, turn away, get out of there, touch nothing unclean; get out from the midst of her, keep yourselves clean, YOU who are carrying the utensils of Jehovah.For YOU people will get out in no panic, and YOU will go in no flight. For Jehovah will be going even before YOU , and the God of Israel will be YOUR rear guard. Look! My servant will act with insight. He will be in high station and will certainly be elevated and exalted very much. To the extent that many have stared at him in amazement—so much was the disfigurement as respects his appearance more than that of any other man and as respects his stately form more than that of the sons of mankind—he will likewise startle many nations. At him kings will shut their mouth, because what had not been recounted to them they will actually see, and to what they had not heard they must turn their consideration.” Isaiah 52:11-15
Was this prophesy fulfilled? Indeed, it was:
“… when he said to them: “I am [he],” they drew back and fell to the ground.” John 18:6
And… if he WAS born with perfect flesh… the question is: how did he die? Because PERFECT flesh… does not die. Because (1) there is NO sin or death IN it… and thus, (1) it has no “wage” to PAY.
What kind of sign was given to Ahaz that he could interpret 700 years later?
Ummm… you’re gonna have to elaborate there, dear one, if you would be so kind. Thank you.
Careful with me.... I've been known to slowly persuade MANY away from Jesus and eliminate their crutches....
Perhaps, but I don’t perceive you as one I should fear… or be particularly “careful” with.
How about this question.... for Shelby and other believes in the Jesus story and the bible in general... Do you believe that without Jesus or belief in Jesus as a savior, one cannot be "saved"?
The word of my Lord is that I am to direct you to consider Rahab… and Ruth. Neither believed in the Most Holy One of Israel, per se (i.e., did not worship Him)… but both “do good” to His servants. And as a result, the one (Rahab) saved herself… and her entire household… when Jericho was reduced to destruction. Ruth, due to her love for NAOMI… came to be a direct ancestor of my Lord. That same salvation is granted to those who do good to Christ’s brothers. Matthew 25:34-40
In other words, if I know some Jewish people that have lived their entire lives lawfully wed, not committing adultery, not hurting anyone ever, never stealing and always eating clean, keeping the Sabbath day (Saturday), etc, and living basically a Torah adherent life, but they do not accept Jesus, they can't stand the idea of him... will they be condemned to the lake of fire?
Have you not heard that ALL Israel will be saved… NOT by means of the Law (because under it they are condemned – because if you transgress just ONE … you transgress them ALL )… but because of the love… and FAITH… of Abraham… who did not withhold HIS only-begotten son (by his FREE wife, Sarah)… when called by God to offer him up? By means of his FAITH… Abraham saved his entire household… including his enduring lineage through his son, Isaac. Romans 11:26
On the flip side, what about a cocaine addict that lived 30 years of his life robbing people, stealing, killing, a life of gluttony, drunkenness, etc... then one day he accepts Jesus as savior.... will he be saved? According to the New Testament, the coke addict will live forever in paradise, while the Jewish couple will die because they do not accept the son....
The Most Holy One of Israel shows mercy to whomever HE wishes to show it, dear one. One is not saved by one’s works… but by one’s FAITH. But faith… without works that DEMONSTRATE such faith… can prove to have no value. Right? Luke 23:39-43I'm merely trying to still seek some answers from those who are religious.
Why? What makes you believe that anyone “religious” can… and does… know more than you?
Not being religious, I'm not shoving anything down anyone's throat.
I don’t believe that you are, dear one… at least, not based on this particular thread…
People are free to believe in whatever they like.
Indeed.
However, if they are going to promote their beliefs, and live a life allegedly mimicking that belief, they need to prove that they are doing so.
I understand what you are saying… and why, giving religion’s track record… but I am not so sure ANYONE needs to prove ANYTHING to ANYONE.
I doubt highly that Shelby has given away all her possessions, can cast out demons, raise the dead, etc, no? Shelby, can you do what Jesus commands? If not, why not ?
I have done the first… and still do it, to the extent I can (I am married, with children/grandchildren) and so when I asked my Lord about this, he pretty much left it up to me. So, I tend to give what I have to those who ask… regardless of who they are… but I do not live as an ascetic…
As for casting out demons, yes, I have done that. As for raising the dead, believe it or not, I have not had a single person known to ME… who has died since my Lord called me. Not one. And, yes, it’s kind of strange to me, too. On another note, while I do have certain gifts of the spirit, healing is not one of them… by that is ENTIRELY on me: I do not have the love… faith… and courage… it takes to “carry” such a gift IN me.
You see, those who TRULY heal by means of holy spirit… do so by taking the illness into THEIR flesh… with FAITH… that my Lord will “make their mortals bodies “alive.” I KNOW this is true… I have absolutely NO doubt about it… as I know of those who have done it. I did not see them do it, but I know them… and I know those who they healed. THEY, however, had SUCH love… and pity… for those they healed… that they were willing to take on such ones’ infirmities. They did it… merely because, like my Lord… they wanted to.
I confess, however, that I have not asked my Lord specifically for such gift. And he has not offered it to me as a result. And that is one of the primary reasons I come here and openly share the gift I DO have: hopefully, it will result in some value… for where I have failed those who I COULD help… and my Lord. But… I don’t have the amount of faith… or the courage… to ask for and carry such a gift. That is the truth… and one of my shames.
All I would need to do is ASk… and the gift would be granted me because he KNOWS I would NOT use it for personal or monetary gain, but the build up his body. To give people a reason to rejoice and praise JAH… and to the glory of God.
Perhaps one day I will have such courage… and faith. In the meantime, I am making myself his servant… to the greatest extent I can… by serving him… God… the Household of God , Israel … those who go with that “house”… and, to the extent I can… to the world.
I truly wish I had more courage… more faith… and more love, dear Fester, but the TRUTH… is that I do not. And it is because I don’t, although I see all of the suffering around me… that I am grateful for him. I have openly confessed to you: I am a sinner, and thus, while you and some here may NOT be in need… I… am in need of a savior.
Praise JAH… it is His Son and Christ… my Lord… the Holy One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA MISHAJAH… who is the image of the LIVING God, the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies… whose love does NOT keep account of the injury… but hopes all things, bears all things… and NEVER… fails.
I am living testimony to this truth.
I bid you peace (or, as you wrote "Shalom Aleichem" to!). Truly.
YOUR servant, as I am servant to ALL those of the Household of God, Israel, all whose those who go with… and a slave of Christ,
SA
