Resurrection: A Cruel Joke?

by cameo-d 27 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  EndofMysteries

  Cameo-D - watch the movie the 6th day, that is what your implying. In the movie the 6th day, clones are made of humans, and the memories are 'downloaded' into them, so they don't realize they are a clone unless they knew they would be prior to the memory being recorded.

  Anyway, the humans are under the assumption that 'they' are being resurrected or brought back. Later on in the movie, it's obvious that it's a new life w/ just the memories of another. (as you can see personalities different even though had same memories)

  Dark City is another movie you would like a well, it's about people abducted by aliens, and each day they have their memories changed to memories of another person and seeing if they act with the memories they have

  Sounds like your jumping ahead in trying to understand the resurrection. Jumping ahead in the sense of, your real question is "What is life?" or "What are you?". You want to know if your feelings, emotions, thoughts, what makes you an 'individual', what is life? Are you a biological robot in which 'anybody' living your life and life experiences would end up identically the same way, that your choices and how you live life are calculations based on programming. OR if everything identical, each one would still end up a different 'person'.

  I'm too tired to go into the bible teachings, but next step is what teaching or understanding do you have of the resurrection and such. Blind leading the blind for such a long time, gotta make sure your belief in what it teaches is in harmony with all the scriptures and if not, get that sorted first.
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  cameo-d

  JWFacts

  That was very interesting information; I did not know that WT teaches "humans are just a collection of memories and emotions that reside as a memory within God." Now I understand where you are coming from. Those teachings I assume, also imply that "God" is an external being. That WT teaching, like so many others, seems flawed. It would imply that we do not actually exist and that we are a figment of someone's elses imagination. Grossly flawed. Purposely obtuse.

  You said "the robot is not exactly the same as a resurrected human."

  JWFacts, that's where the cruel trick becomes apparent! The robot is not your idea of what resurrection should be! BUT, it could be the idea of the resurrection that has been intended all along!

  Religious leaders have allowed many ideas to be subjective and that's why you have only been given hints along the way. No details. It has all been left to your imagination.

  This prototype in the film could very well be the intended resurrection. Your memories and emotions are what make you---you. It's your inner core. Your essence. And this new body does seem to fit other aspects of the resurrection promise----silicon could be the solution to "eternal youth". Barbie and Ken do not make babies. And they don't have any genetalia, either. Perhaps these new bodies will be from actual human cells that are cloned and then plasticized.

  No more pain, no more sorrow. With a plastic body maybe there would be no nerve endings and no pain if your leg breaks. No tears, of course not. No body fluids. Flesh and blood cannot enter the Kingdom. No sorrow...memories can be selectively downloaded or even erased. Your wife gets DF'd, they erase her memory of you. Viola! Shunning made easy.
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  cameo-d

  Just think....in a post-apocalyptic world....in a silicone body

  There would be no worries of food shortages or whether monsanto is poisoning the food because your body could be made to run on solar and wind power rather than food.

  You would never be sick because plastic would be impermeable to viruses and bacterias. There would be no need for hospitals or pharmaceuticals.

  Even if the oceans are black tar and all the fish and birds are dead, you could be programmed to envision the past world in a holographic form.

  What a perfect work force of slaves you would all be!
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  cameo-d

  Mind uploading or whole brain emulation (mind transfer)

  "Since a half mouse neural network model was simulated in a supercomputer in 2007, at a simulation speed of one tenth of real time, supercomputers are expected to reach sufficient capacity for whole human brain emulation within a few years."

  "Most suggestions for scanning technologies would destroy the original biological brain."

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mind_uploading
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  darthfader

  Great thread. This subject has been on my mind for a while now. If we are really nothimg more than electrochemical goo -- then the resurrection would bring back only a copy of us. It seems that the JW thinking about death and the "soul" and the resurrection are at odds.
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  PSacramento

  If I remember correctly, in the OT, the ressurection was described as "bones coming to life and the sinews and flesh being remade/reattached to them and the spirit/soul coming back into our bodies and reanimating them".

  Or something like that...
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  gubberningbody

  There's a bit of an association between the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, which roughly says that you can know the location, or velocity of a given object with a high degree of certainly, but not both simultaneously and Cyclomatic complexity, which is a mathematical calculation of the complexity of a program.

  In order to engineer a device which will model the human brain, we'd need understand both the Cyclomatic complexity of the human brain, as well as design a system which operates according to the same principles. The business of consciousness is a very complicated thing. The sense of being alive and feeling alive is as well.

  ... Ok, I'm thinking how I can better explain this....

  Can you visualize 10 dimensions (not an analogue of ten dimensions, but actually ten dimensions(and don't define these as properties in an attemp to escape if you happen to be an object-oriented programmer)?

  No, you can't. You simply lack the structures to do so. You can mathematically model ten dimensions, but you can never ever actually visualize ten dimensions.

  This should give you an idea of the problem presented.

  Simply put, we are not as smart as our own brains. We lack the capacity to be as smart as they are instinctively.

  Consciousness is like the Eloi in H.G. Wells book the "Time Machine", and the brain can be likened to the Morlocks.

  The Eloi are the child-like, frail group, living a banal life of ease on the surface of the earth, while the Morlocks live underground, tending machinery and providing food, clothing and infrastructure for the Eloi.

  Your consciousness and my consciousness is only a very small part of what is happening. This is all very superficial.

  Only a "brain" larger than our brain can engineer a brain.

  We can model brains smaller than ours but even these are really stretching our limits...

  "The computers will not have artificial intelligence, and scientists remain many years away from building one that matches even the abilities of a simple mouse brain."

  This from " IBM starts work on computer to rival the human brain"...

  http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article833106.ece
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  cameo-d

  PSacremento: "bones coming to life and the sinews and flesh being remade"

  But how can that even be correct if Jesus said that "Flesh and blood cannot enter the kingdom of heaven"? Wouldn't that mean a different type of body? Silicon would fit the bill, wouldn't it?