by alamb 24 Replies latest jw friends
I have been pointing out that the shunning doctrine is unscriptural and unloving (JW speak). He texted that my whole family stayed in the "truth" it was me who left.
Please give the concise words to answer him. I know it won't really do any good to try to reason with him, it will just feel good to "nail it."
tell him that you still value truth above all else. whever that truth may be, however difficult it may be to accept. Let him know that Jehovah and the christ are the higest standard you know, and you can only find and accept truth through them.
then offer him the red pill.
My children were victims of shunning by association of me, their mother. I was disassociated due to their not handling matters with a molester, my father.
I went back through your first posts of many years ago. Your father was your molester? And now he is shunning you? Do I have this straight?
He texted that my whole family stayed in the "truth" it was me who left.
You could text back ... "The Bible states that Jesus Christ is the truth. No where in the Bible does it say the Watchtower is."
Start off on a common ground. Agree that the Apostles supports congregational discipline, but that meaning can be easily misunderstood. Then consider the scriptures:
1 Corinthians 5:11-13 “Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man.”
Am I a "so-called brother"? No This scripture warns against hypocrites who claim to be a brother, but then do things contrary to their claim. I no longer claim to be "a brother" (in the narrow definition that a brother is a JW), so this scripture no longer applies and I should be treated as all other worldy people.
Titus 9, 10: As for a man that promotes a sect, reject him after a first and a second admonition; knowing that such a man has been turned out of the way and is sinning.”
Am I promoting a sect? Let's see the WT definition of sect in August 2010 Awake! pg. 6 "A sect is a dissenting group with a religious community or one that breaks away to form a new religion." I am not promoting any new religion that is an offshoot of JWs, nor am I a dissenting group within JWs. I am no longer a JW and I am now a worldly person.
1 John 2: 18 Young children, it is the last hour, and, just as YOU have heard that antichrist is coming, even now there have come to be many antichrists; from which fact we gain the knowledge that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us. But [they went out] that it might be shown up that not all are of our sort. 20 And YOU have an anointing from the holy one; all of YOU have knowledge. 21 I write YOU, not because YOU do not know the truth, but because YOU know it, and because no lie originates with the truth.
Am I the antichrist? (If no, then just stop there. If they say yes, then continue: Who is the antichrist? According to the 2001 August 8 Awake, the antichrists are all governments, false religions, and members of these. Scripturally, the antichrist is one who "Denies the father and the son" (1 John 2:22). Why is this scripture only applied to those who leave the WT and not all those identified by the WTS as the antichrist? A convenient double standard. (Note that most WT publications usually only quote vs 19,20, leaving out the vital detail that the scripture is referring to the antichrist)).
What did Jesus have to say about the matter?
(Matthew 18:15-17) 15 “Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go lay bare his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, in order that at the mouth of two or three witnesses every matter may be established. 17 If he does not listen to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen even to the congregation, let him be to you just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector.
(Mark 2:15-17) 15 Later he happened to be reclining at the table in his house, and many tax collectors and sinners were reclining with Jesus and his disciples, for there were many of them and they began following him. 16 But the scribes of the Pharisees, when they saw he was eating with the sinners and tax collectors, began saying to his disciples: “Does he eat with the tax collectors and sinners?” 17 Upon hearing this Jesus said to them: “Those who are strong do not need a physician, but those who are ill do. I came to call, not righteous people, but sinners.”
Jesus said to treat an unrepentant one as a man of the nations (wordly person) and as a tax collector (sinner). How did Jesus view tax collectors? Notice Jesus reply to the Pharisees who accused him of eating with the tax collectors. Jesus was reaching out to help them, he was not shunning them. (The JW response is that when Jesus said to treat people as tax collectors, he was referring to the fact that the Jews did not have close contact with gentile tax collectors. The rebuttal is that Jesus set the example for how we should act, which is much more important).
If he is not thinking straight, it would be a big challenge to change his thinking.
Does anyone have the July 2009 watchtower or awake mag that showed that a person should not be shunned for their religious beliefs and can they post them for her. The front of the mag talked about depression.
Maybe your father needs to see the double standard they have on this issue.
