Hello again Rick,
You said:
Rick: Norm, although the Bible writers were inspired of God to write the canonized scriptures (both Hebrew and Greek), the message was NOT intended to be "perfect." An example of perfection was the ten commandments which Jehovah inscribed in stone for Moses. As you well know the Bible was NOT inscribed by Jehovah directly. It was penned by imperfect humans.
Ah, here we go with usual excusogetics. It will be funny to watch this verbal acrobatics in a desperate attempt to explain away awkward Bible texts.
Rick: Now suppose the ten commandments were penned by Moses instead of directly by Jehovah? Can you imagine the possible biases that might creep into the text?
Then why did Jehovah chose to use ordinary, imperfect and sometimes biased humans to inspired to write down the Biblical account?
Suppose? They weren’t even penned my Moses Rick. Read the text and you don’t have to IMAGINE anything. Only Israeli lives counted, all other people were worthless. If Jehovah in any way USED these murdering bastards he is of course responsible. No way you can wiggle out of that Rick.
Rick: As you may recall in the book of Proverbs, the divinely inspired wise man wrote: "The path of the righteous is like the first gleam of dawn, shining ever brighter till the full light of day." (Proverbs 4:18)
Uh oh, here we go, hand waving and special pleading using the “divine” word to refute or explain away another “divine” word. What a discipline.
Rick: The Hebrew scriptures are "like the first gleam of dawn," Norm, when the world was in a primitive age and mankind were for the most part barbarians. Jehovah had to work with these primitives, and somehow communicate with them. They related to Jehovah as a God of war, because war is all they knew. Much of the barbarianism you read in the Hebrew scriptures originated from man during the course of God's leading him, ultimately, toward this age of enlightenment, in preparation for the grand finale ... a kingdom of peace and prosperity.
Yes, poor Jehovah, he HAD to assist them in their genocide and ethnic cleansing, wholesale slaughter and all kinds of atrocities. This loving, all wise, all knowing, all powerful being, he just HAD to. What prime time manure you serve Rick. Do you actually read what you say here Rick?
Rick: You might argue that even if Jehovah didn't give the orders to kill those precious little babies and other heinous acts against women and kids, that he bears responsibility. You have argued that God has the power not to sit back and watch bad things to happen to good people. However, in all due respect, your reasoning is marred. You seem to keep ignoring the bigger picture.
Yeah, you might argue all kinds of lame excuses Rick, and indeed you do. Well, if we are to believe that God is Omnipotent he is indeed watching BAD things happen, and here we go again, you continue to produce more hopeless lame hand waving and excuses.
Rick: In Isaiah 30:26, notice that Jehovah takes full responsibility for the acts of people whom, in retrospect, we now view as barbarians: "The moon will shine like the sun, and the sunlight will be seven times brighter, like the light of seven full days, when the LORD binds up the bruises of his people and heals the wounds he inflicted."
This scripture appears to point to an age of enlightenment when knowledge of Jehovah's creation -- from the sciences to earth's geologic history to the human anatomy and its health to moral awareness -- will be abundant amongst humans. The suffering humans endured throughout history and the "bruises" that Jehovah inflicted on people were for a purpose. Although mankind could have obliterated itself, we have reached this present-day golden age of prosperity and spiritual enlightenment. Soon in a symbolic but very real sense the collective light of seven full days of human experience as Jehovah patiently helped his creation reach a spiritual plateau, will shine extremely brightly. So brightly will it shine, that even the Moon that reflects sunlight "will shine like the sun, and the sunlight will be seven times brighter." All these terrible things you point to that mankind has endured through human history are coming to an end, Norm, when Jehovah "binds up the bruises of his people and heals the wounds he inflicted." Again, these wounds were really inflicted by imperfect men but Jehovah takes full responsibility.
All I can say Rick is that you should make an extensive study of history and you will find that the progress mankind has done towards enlightenment, democracy and human rights only became possible because the power of Bible thumping morons were diminished.
Rick: I was determined to keep the explanation simple. I hope you can now understand that there was no other way for Jehovah to bring humanity from its debased state after the fall of Adam and Eve, to its present state of spiritual enlightenment and preparation for the restoration of Eden. This restoration will be accomplished through the divine cleansing our planet to ecological perfection.
Yup, it was extremely simple Rick, simple and complete hogwash.
Rick: The history of human civilization has without argument been a bloodbath of pain and suffering for all. All of those precious little babies who died, and everyone else for that matter who suffered the wages of our sinful condition brought about from the disobedience of our ancestors Adam and Eve, will return to life someday! They will not remember their pain and suffering, Norm, so why concern yourself?
Yes, what shining examples of reasoning. Why concern myself with the crimes committed with molesting children, why do Bill bother? Why this uproar over September 11th? All those people will be resurrected! Wow! You really do have a good grasp of this haven’t you, Rick?
Rick: I'm not minimizing it, but this is par for the course in human history. Blaming God when these tragedies were a consequence of God's efforts to SAVE mankind -- and when all concerned will live forever in peace and joy without the memories of their past and primitive lives -- is completely illogical in light mankind's final outcome when Jehovah assures us that "He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away." (Revelation 21:4) Derrick
Yes, the usual bullshit. Don’t worry about this life, your real life begins after death. Rick. Dear oh dear, where have we heard that before? As I expected you offered no explanations regarding what my "lies" were.
Norm
