Child Abuse Policy question re: credible evidence

by Open mind 20 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

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  Open mind

  I'm familiar with the two witness rule and just read that it still stands in the new Elder's book.

  If a child accuses someone of sexual abuse:

  1. Call the branch

  2. Meet with the child & the accused.

  3. If the accused denies the charge, document it, put it in the Congregation File and wait for another child to be abused before you can take judicial action.

  Here's my question:

  If 12 year old Johnny gets raped by Joe Elder and Johnny has the presence of mind to call 9-1-1 (unlikely, but bear with me) then what?

  Suppose the police obtain DNA evidence from Johnny that confirms Joe Elder actually raped him.

  Are the elders allowed to use DNA evidence as a 2nd "witness"?

  Or, do they have to say, "Sorry, we've only got one witness, and as long as Joe Elder denies it, all we can do is file it away and wait for him to strike again?"

  I'm a former elder, but I honestly don't know for sure. I think that the policy only allows for two "eyewitnesses" to establish guilt. Anyone with experience here or who knows of a thread where this specific question has been addressed, I'd love to hear from you.

  Thanks in advance,

  om
• 

  fokyc

  Here is their present policy:

  http://www.jw-media.org/aboutjw/article23.htm

  I can't quote, as it's copyrighted!
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  Mickey mouse

  Common sense would dictate that forensic evidence should count as a second witness but hey, since when has common sense had any influence on WT policy?!
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  KW13

  Unfortunately the Society are sticking to the Old Testament on this and other matters. Two Witnesses or no justice. Quite a joke really because not many rapists, child molesters, murderers and other dregs of society plan to do this with a friend present for moral support.
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  Open mind

  fokyc, thanks for the link to jw-media.org.

  I think the policy page is very well written from a PR standpoint. If an outsider were to read it, they would think the Watchtower has a reasonable policy in place.

  The two biggies that remain, IMO are:

  1. No clear direction to the elders to IMMEDIATELY call the authorities.

  2. No clear direction that forensic evidence may be considered in lieu of a second witness.

  I have a gut feeling, (big whoop) that the branch would probably honor DNA evidence as a "second witness". But who knows for sure?

  om
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  Lady Lee

  There has been discussion which quotes showing that they could accept DNA as the "second witness" But they could disregard it too. Its an option.

  They could also take the word of a second victim as long as that victim is a

  witness kid. if the second victim is not a Witness kid than they will not use it as the second witness. They use the word "credible" witness and that word rules out non-Witness kids.

  I have this sneaky feeling that if the kid is one who is usually in trouble with the elders for whatever reasons they may use "credible" to discount their story.

  What it boils down to is if they can hide it they will. If they can shut the victim and the family up they will.

  There has been eye-witness evidence of elders going into court and speaking up for the accused, giving them glowing character references even after these people have been found guilty in a court of law that found there was enough evidence to support the complaint. This was caught on news video!!!

  The name of the game is deny deny deny. According to them these convicted child rapists and child molesters were wrongfully accused and convicted because according to WTS standards they did not have a second eye-witness and they person continued to deny it.
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  Georgiegirl

  What I don't understand is this. If you are accused of anything and ask who your accusers are, the elders won't tell you. But in THESE types of cases, they can have a young child/victim face the accuser? Nice double standard in the worst possible way.
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  Open mind

  Thanks for the info Lee.

  I was almost hoping that their policy would be to ignore DNA evidence 100% just so they'd look even more unreasonable.

  Oh well.

  Georgiegirl: Good point. Elders are famous for keeping "wrongdoers" on the ropes because the elders hold the trump card of deciding repentance or not. If a person is too insistent on knowing who their accuser is, the elders can take that as a hardened, unrepentant attitude. Except when it comes to child abusers.

  om
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  Lady Lee

  agreed
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  Nickolas

  Is 12 year old Johnny credible? If he has a history of telling stories then one might need to be circumspect. If he has been a model child who has shown no previous history of being mischievious, then one might need to take him seriously. If Johnny was my child I would put him through the wringer and if he prevailed I would move heaven and earth to put his molester behind bars.