by MrFreeze 25 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
There are only two reasons to speak with elders:
(1) Get yourself disfellowshipped
(2) Lie
Your list above indicates that you're interested in #1.
These specific men may actually agree with you on a specific point or two. However, this doesn't matter. Why? Because they KNOW that Watchtower is God's Organization.
You can play this game and survive if you do it carefully (I dont know if you even want to but it can be done).
I.e., before and after your doubts include things such as:
** These are things I have been struggling with and I'm willing to continue to pray and research on these matters
** I know in the past that God's will and/or organization has needed to be clarified such as when the apostles did not understand jesus' statements about drinking his blood or misunderstood when jesus would return; or when the early JW's needed to have most of their practices refined and changed. Its not like I'm going to run off to another religion here, but there are some things that don't make sense and I too am willing to wait to see if they can get properly corrected, but I don't want to endorse things through comments/preaching/talks while I am waiting and researching.
simon, the second thing you did was EXACTLY what I tried and they seemed to see through that pretty easily. And Think About It, even if I don't use it here to full with the elders, I can still leave it posted on this forum to help somebody else who is struggling with doubts. It may not do anything to these elders or anybody else I know personally but I can at least keep the points in my mind for if I'm trying to help somebody else escape. If nothing else, it's at least helped me confirm my decision. I'll probably give a copy of the list to my mother as well. Maybe that will lay a seed of doubt. I can hope. There will be more coming, later tonight probably.
Here's what I have so far after working on it for a little bit
Yeah, well, good luck with that, dear Mr. Freeze (peace to you!). Dear TAI is right: the only place you're going to get with such a list is DF'd. And the list will simply be the "proof" they will use to justify it ("See?! Here is PROOF of his apostasy!!").
How is this? Because they have their own explanation for No. 1, dear one, and their own excuse for No. 3, and don't give a hang about what history shows the actual dates to be as to No. 3. If it doesn't correspond with their 1914 melarkey, it's wrong. Period. End of discussion. You will NOT get through. Why? Because right now, they "love" the lie. Even have a book of them. They call it the "Reasoning" Book. And so nothing you can do about that and nothing you can do to change your fate, now.
Not meaning to be harsh, just honest and realistic. Prepare yourself for what's coming. It's the only thing you can do. And "it" IS coming.
Again, peace to you!
A slave of Christ,
SA
Oh yes AG, I'm aware of what's coming. I am not scared of being disfellowshipped. I already expressed my opinions of the doubts I had. It would only be a matter of time anyway. Why not speed up the process, all while compiling a list for future reference for those on here as well.
With that in mind, here's a couple more. Maybe somebody could help refine my last sentence for number 8 so that it makes a little more sense:
7) Quotes about 1975:
"If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. Why not? Because all the evidence in fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years. Of the generation that observed the beginning of the "last days" in 1914, Jesus foretold: "This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur."-Matt. 24:34. Therefore, as a young person, you will never fulfill any career that this system offers. If you are in highschool and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!" Awake! 1969 May 22 p.15
"The fact that fifty-four years of the period called the "last days" have already gone by is highly significant. It means that only a few years, at most, remain before the corrupt system of things dominating the earth is destroyed by God." Awake! 1968 October 8 p.13
In the Awake of 1971 October 8 a timeline was presented with the "Millennial reign of Jesus Christ" starting on the six thousandth year with the caption "As we near the end of 6,000 years of human history in the mid-1970's there is the thrilling hope of a grand relief."
8) Will those in Sodom and Gomorrah be resurrected?
At first it's yes:
"Thus our Lord teaches that the Sodomites did not have a full opportunity; and he guarantees them such opportunity." Studies in the Scriptures, Series I p.110 (see also w.1879 July p.8)
Then it's no:
"He was pin-pointing the utter impossibility of ransom for unbelievers or those willfully wicked, because Sodom and Gomorrah were irrevocably condemned and destroyed, beyond any possible recovery." Watchtower 1954 February 1 p.85
Then it's yes again:
"As in the case of Tyre and Sidon, Jesus showed that Sodom, bad as it was, had not got to the state of being unable to repent ... So the spiritual recovery of the dead people of Sodom is not hopeless" Watchtower 1965 March 1 p.139
"It will be more endurable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah on Judgment Day than for that city." Sodom and Gomorrah were everlastingly destroyed as cities, but this would not preclude a resurrection for people of those cities." Insight on the Scriptures, Volume 2 p.985
Then finally they won't be resurrected:
"Consequently, in addition to what Jude 7 says, the Bible uses Sodom/Gomorrah and the Flood as patterns for the destructive end of the present wicked system. It is apparent, then, that those whom God executed in those past judgments experienced irreversible destruction." Watchtower 1988 June 1 p.31 Questions From Readers
Why the changes back and forth? If they are only making adjustments because Jehovah is revealing it to them, why do they revert back to being resurrected and then back again repeatedly?
Why not speed up the process, all while compiling a list for future reference for those on here as well.
Ah, yes, I get it now, dear MFreeze! Peace to you!
A slave of Christ,
SA
