by AiAi 26 Replies latest watchtower bible
It seems I was not clear enough in my post? I was asking are there any passages or statements in the bible that can be used to prove it wrong. I used 1914 as an example since it can be used to prove the watchtower wrong. so what im wondering is, are there any strong arguments against the bible? such the 2 different lists of christs lineage?
thank you for the effort concerning 1914. I have that entire teaching understood....or I thought i did till LS58 commented lol
...so what im wondering is, are there any strong arguments against the bible?
AiAi, there are quite a few, here are some I found at: http://ffrf.org/legacy/books/lfif/?t=contra
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Also, compare Joshua 2:4-6 with James 2:25.
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I was taught as a child that when you take something without asking for it, that is stealing.
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The common defense here is that "we are saved by faith and works." But Paul said "not of works."
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Pro-slavery bible verses were cited by many churches in the South during the Civil War, and were used by some theologians in the Dutch Reformed Church to justify apartheid in South Africa. There are more pro-slavery verses than cited here.
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See also II Kings 20:1-7, Numbers 16:20-35, Numbers 16:44-50.
See Genesis 18:23-33, where Abraham gets God to change his mind about the minimum number of righteous people in Sodom required to avoid destruction, bargaining down from fifty to ten. (An omniscient God must have known that he was playing with Abraham's hopes for mercy--he destroyed the city anyway.)
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"Record" and "witness" in the above verses are the same Greek word (martyria).
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It does no good to claim that "Let us" is the magisterial "we." Such usage implies inclusivity of all authorities under a king's leadership. Invoking the Trinity solves nothing because such an idea is more contradictory than the problem it attempts to solve.
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See also Genesis 22:15-19, Genesis 31:53, and Judges 11:30-39.
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It is an ad hoc defense to claim that there are two methods of reckoning time here. It has never been shown that this is the case.
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3Mozzies
wow. 3Mozzies that is exactly what I was looking for. With the apologetics I know I could explain away alot of the subjects but you provided enough that, at least to myself, if i explained them all then i would just seem unreasonable. I havent made up my mind yet but I am leaning towards the bible just being a book so points such as these are much appreciated
Dear AiAI,
I enjoy your threads and posts immensely, can I respectfully suggest a good book to read which I think is appropriate ?
I found Karen Armstong's "The Bible- a bigraphy" so very helpful when I was asking exactly the same questions as you. Karens erudite and yet accessable way of writing is so illuminating.
I know there are other books showing the problems with the Bible, by Bart Erhman etc but this one was enough to show me that the Bible was just as TD describes it above.
The book is in paperback and is cheap enough on Amazon or get it from a library. her other books on God (2) and on Islam etc. are very good, I feel she has helped to educate me no end since my leaving the WT's wonderful education system ,wotta joke that was !
58 years I spent and came out knowing nothing of value.
DING: 1914 is just as much a non-biblical WT date as 1874, 1918-1919, 1925, and 1975."The generation that saw the events of 1914" has no special connection to Bible end times prophecies.
1874 AND 1914 were two dates focussed on by the WTS and they are Biblically relevant as I stated. 1874-1994 is the 120-year generation of Noah and 1914-1994 is the 80-year generation of the "signs of the last days."
1914 is the date used for when Christ sends out his slaves to do work. It is when the 11-hours of vineyard work begins.
1874 is the time when Christ begins his activity in the world to start things up that lead to the events of the second coming. In the Bible it is the time at Daniel 12:1 when "Michael stands up."
Other Biblically significant dates are 1886 when the "temple in its right condition" occurs in connection with the WTS.
1947 is the beginning of the 70th JUBILEE of 49 years from 1947-1996.
1996 ends the covenant of ONE WEEK for the Jews as well as Jehovah's witnesses as a special "temple" organization.
Of course, as noted, 1992 fulfills 3 chronologies in the Bible that fulfill the year of the second coming.
Now even though the WTS focussed on these dates and spoke of them incorrectly, they still served as a focus and a warning about chronology, a chronology that would not be corrected until after 1996. Remember, all ten virgins nod and their lamps grow dim at one point. Then, after the messiah has arrived those with their own EXTRA OIL are able to understand all the chronology.
At any rate, all of these dates are past events so we can retrospectively calculate everything from the second coming back to the fall of Jerusalem in 529 BCE, back to the Exodus in 1386 BCE now. It's a matter of updating and understanding.
In the meantime the WTS is cast out into spiritual darkness since they are apostate now.
LS58
Oh for gawds sake Lars, numerology is so 19th century, get to know Jesus, He will tell you what you need to do, not waste time on "genealogies which end up in nothing....." 1Tim1v4 (NWT)
Thank you Wobble for the suggestions, im gonna see if i cant find them as pdf because I am too broke. I did read Age of Reason by Paine recently and allthough some of his reasonings are now outdated or were wrong (to me at least) his method of reasoning is very intrigueing. I will def add those books to the list of ones i want to buy when I have money though! :)
Ask yourself this: Did anything actually happen in 1914?
Well - WW1 started in 1914. Did C. T. Russell predict WW1? NO. He predicted the coming of Christ and the end of the world.
When it was obvious that Christ did not come, the Russellites claimed that he came INVISIBLY. That is simply pathetic.
Their descendants, the JWs, spent decades saying that the generation of people who were adults in 1914 would see the end of the world.
It didn't happen. They had to modify their prophecy again.
Thus we come to the ludicrous end of the so-called prophetic year 1914 - and it was a complete failure.
Bookmarked.
I was so surprised when I first found out that 1914 was supposed to be armegeddon and it wasnt until years later they adopted the current view. that was something that made me realise they dont get 'new light' until they are proven absolutely wrong and have to change their teaching. but my question isnt about 1914, that was just an example of a false teaching and im mostly wondering if there are things like that in the bible, ie the smallest seed in the world is a mustard grain.
