Judgment Day? For Lars & JCanon- Your Hero, Harold Camping.
by whereami 22 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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OBVES
I am not a follower of Harold Camping some may assume. I consider him as the best opponent to my beliefs and those of Jehovah's Witnesses.
Come on , read my posts on alt.bible (a google group ) . Camping is against Jehovah's Witnesses as he is against all other local churches .
I am in turn making some exceptions to prove an important requirement for the endtimes to prove we are in .
We must have a period of 120 years taken into account as a sign of Noah's days when ark was being built . Harold Camping is trapped in his declaration in my view as he doesn't have this 120-year period . He would have to find people that are related to this period . Only the International Bible Students and after them Jehovah's Witnesses fit this period !
His May 21,2011 is shaky despite of the fact that many people like his calculations leading to that date.He was helped on that as he has many people calling him or writing him giving him advice.But we may presume he is distinct in this proclamation like no other man on this planet and he is a peculiar person check on wikipedia about him . He is number 1 on radio unquestionably and worthy to listen to get him in his mistakes and to learn some things .
I am a vivid listener to his Open Forum program.I advise you to listen to for a few times at least .I am waiting for his date may 21 ,2011. Count days .It will be a necessity to hear his two last Open Forum programs : on May 19 and 20 . I wonder about May 20 as in Jerusalem will be already May 21 using our time. So just in case I must get him on May 18 too necessarily .
Never before there was anything like that as now we have the internet and Family Radio broadcasts to many countires of the world and people put billboards in so many places . This will be waitng !
Camping is putting his reputation on line and imagine what will be on Open Forum next week after May 21 if May 21 passes by as a usual day .
He has no back up date he claims . He must believe in 100% it will happen as he says .
I have in turn back-up dates , and not one .So my is the prediction . It can be viewed like you were going to cast a die with 6 sides with dots from 1 to 6 dots . Only a result with one dot would mean a failed prediction for September 29,2011 .What thoughts would come into your mind and what would you do if you faced this ? One dot = failure of the prediction all other results on top side after a throw would mean a fulfillment of the prediction ( dots from 2 to 6 ).That is why it is like a prediction with a 83-84 % chance .
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avengers
You guys sure do love the Bologna.
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Awen
Why do people insist on trying to utter prophecies or interepret prophecies when Jesus said very plainly that " No one knows the day and the hour"?
Oh wait, I know. They want people to follow them and give them worship, the same way Satan does. Now I get it.
People want admiration from other people and to be viewed as someone wise and to be admired. Same as the Pharisees , but instead of prayers, it's prophecy.
Matthew 6:5 "And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full."
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Larsinger58
Time is running out and it is clear that Jehovah now has a focus on the elect and has little concern for those who are not going to make it understanding any details involved. So I'll just be blunt.
Yes, OBVES and Harold Camping are prophets of Jehovah. He is using them to focuss on 2011 just as he used JWs to focus on 1874 and 1914.
A) Joel's prophecy. The context for Harold Camping and OBVES though is the time period mentioned in Joel where Jehovah would pour out his holy spirit on all kinds of flesh, including old and young, male and female, and they would prophesy. Apply that to modern times and that is quite possible with the advent of the internet and especially YouTube.
B) Note this doesn't make sense in the context of the WTS or any organized religion. That is, no way is the FDS going to let individual members come up with their own prophesying. They don't allow even "anointed ones" to speak on anything not directly supportive of the Watchtower magazine! This is where Harold Camping comes in.
Harold Camping understands that there would be an "end to the church age"!! That is profound. In other words, Jehovah would use the JW organization as the "temple in the right condition" sect following 2300 evenings and mornings, but that would only last 110 years; from 1886-1996!! After that failed organization is no longer "God's channel of communication" then he would inspire knowledge in many other individuals. Two of these individuals are OBVES and Harold Camping. Notice Harold Camping is not head of any church but tells each to seek God individually. That's a sign he is being used by Jehovah. That is, the "broad road leading off into destruction" represents the WTS or organized religion. Going down the "narrow and cramped path" is our individual focus on our relationship with God, without any kind of a human mediator or any organization; just the opposite of what the WTS is promoting. So Camping has the right message at the right time, no formal religion, but individual relationship with God. That's complimentary and amazing at the same time.
OBVES is slightly different. He knows he is being used by Jehovah and recognizes his relationship with the true temple sect, which Jehovah permits.
But step back and funny to me both of them are talking about 2011 AD. But there's a catch. These inspired prophets are like stars in the night. They have tiny bits of specific light in a background of darkness.
Daniel 12:
3 “And the ones having insight will shine like the brightness of the expanse; and those who are bringing the many to righteousness, like the stars to time indefinite, even forever.
4 “And as for you, O Daniel, make secret the words and seal up the book, until the time of [the] end. Many will rove about, and the [true] knowledge will become abundant.”
A star is a tiny light. It does not light up the day like the sun. So these new prophets of YHWH which are using the internet and YouTube to shine their lights are not going to be in agreement on many things. Even Jesus said he did not put "new wine" into "old wineskins." OBVES and Harold Camping are like "old wineskins." They can't handle the new wine. But there is no need.
THE RELEVANT CRITICAL POINT: The relevant critical point for Harold Camping is that he knows specifically that Jehovah says he would not do anything without first notifying his own prophets. That creates a situation that even though no chronology exists for determining the year of Armageddon, that at some point prior to Armageddon some of his prophets would have to warn the world. That's why you can't just ignore Harold Camping. He still believes in the trinity doctrine and the basis for this 2011 AD prediction is not based on accurate chronology, so I guess it doesn't matter. The important thing is that he is having us focus on this date.
Now, as I said, he is like a star shining in a dark sky. So that is his inspired truth. But he doesn't have the "new wine" accuracy of the JIOR. That is, in no way can Armageddon occur on May 21, 2011 AD because Armageddon is the event that ends the worldly governments and establishes the millennial reign of Christ. Per Daniel, this event follows 15 months (or less) of the U.N. ruling the world. So a more accurate understanding of what May 2011 might bring or perhaps before it, is U.N. rule and the end of the Federal Resereve by then.
Harold Camping believes this is also the time of the "rapture" if I'm not mistaken. But the rapture, that is, when those in the flesh become spirit, does not occur until after Judgment Day, when the last person is judged. That is "when mortality puts on imortality." (1 Cor 15:54-57) So basically, nobody is going to heaven until after Judgment Day, which is after Satan is destroyed in the lake of fire, which is after the 1000-year reign.
So we have a situation where Jehovah is using a prophet to give us a date but he does not understand what is really going on. But does it matter? No. The "elect" see through this and adjust. Same with OBVES. He doesn't have the correct chronology either but still managed to come up with a 2011 AD focus. That's interesting!
But from the critical chronologists point of view, 2011 AD tends to be a focal year. That is, with the correct chronology, the likely end of 6000 years after the creation of Eve ends in 2131 AD. The millennium rule of Christ is followed by Satan's last test, which could last say for 20 years, and then Judgment Day, which might last for 100 years. If so, you have to subtract 120 years from 2131 AD as a potential date for when to expect the millennium to begin. 2131 - 120 = 2011 AD.
Consider that the second coming occurred in 1992. 2012 will mark 20 years past that event. Satan was only supposed to be active in the world for a "short while." Well, Biblically 20 years is half a generation of 40 years, so "short while" still works for 20 years. But how much longer? Further, it can't be too long since those resurrected in the first resurrection before 1992 still need to be alive. That is, Jehovah is not going to bother to resurrect a lot of people too far in advance and have them dying off again before the kingdom comes.
The important thing is, the "devil in the details!" God promised he would let his prophets know ahead of time with anything he does, so someone has to be out there making some prediction. But apparently that is the only requirement. When the "great tribulation" stars this May 2011, that part of the prophecy will have been fulfilled. But it is clear this is a warning for the righteous and not the wicked.
OBVES and Harold Camping will not acknowledge me as the Christ. They can't. But it doesn't matter, they are furthering Jehovah's work and checking off some prophecy details so that's all that matters. It is almost as if they are divine lights for MY OWN PERSONAL BENEFIT first and then to the elect. The rest of the world are just confused spectators.
But it is as it should be. OBVES and Camping, who are public, can't handle what is in secret. For instance, John and Paul are still alive from the 1st Century! Can they deal with that? No. Plus John and Paul are totally underground and living in secret. So it just doesn't matter they still have outdated or inaccurate references, they still apparently are being used by Jehovah to focus on 2011 AD, so I'm focussing as well.
So we shall see.
WHAT TO LOOK FORWARD TO: Basically, the U.N. taking over world government by May 2011? That's scary. BTG also includes the "little horn" which is the CIA, so it looks like when world government shifts to the UN the CIA will be seen as a puppet of the Illuminati, which, of course, it is. The CIA was born out of "Skull and Bones"! The majority of FBI agents are Mormons, etc. So we are headed for some hard times.
But Obama apparently the head of the UN will be able to declare "peace and security" within 15 months at which point Armageddon will end. Obama already uses that phrase all the time, which is eerie! Our current economic crisis is perfectly consistent with the soon demise of the Federal Reserve with some in congress already claiming the organization is illegal and unconstitutional. So the stage is set as the Bible says.
So far, everything else has come true, the Holocaust, followed by the new Jewish State of Israel, followed by the second coming in 1992. Hopefully, 2011 AD will see the events leading into Armageddon.
Anyway, we'll see. 2011 AD works for me!!!
Thanks OBVES!!
LS (i.e. Jesus Christ)
P.S. By the way, I admitted to some psychiatric people that I was Jesus Christ. I think they thought I was just making that up to get benefits so never persued it. I'm supposed to appeal for benefits but I've decided not to bother. It's just too hard to accept, except if you are called to accept. Thing is, while most here might consider me to be crazy or delusional for claiming to be the Christ, it seems so far-fetched to psychiatric professionals they think I'm not serious. That is, they presume I'm making it up or don't really believe I'm the messiah. So they don't consider me delusional, just dishonest! It's such a joke.
But things might start to happen for me too! That is, some special powers or something that will convince one and all at some point I'm the true messiah! I'm hoping I'll be able to predict lottery ticket numbers so I'll be super rich during the last days of this wicked old world, not that I could do much with the money. But that would seem rather odd if I suddenly won a few lotteries in a row! The FBI and CIA would know it was through occult (supernatural means) at this point. Obviously, if I have been granted the power to fortell future lottery numbers I might be able to fortell other things and that is of key interest to many people. They want to know what will happen next and if they don't like it, they will want to try to suppress that knowledge or maybe change it! Meaning? Meaning every time I go out to gamble I lose!!! For now!
Have a nice day everybody. Things are starting to get HOT!!!
WHAT WILL NOT HAPPEN IN 2011 AD:
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Larsinger58
THANKS WHEREAMI FOR THE VIDEO!!!! Much appreciated!
LS
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Larsinger58
COMMENTARY ON THE VIDEO:
1. The rapture, as I noted, doesn't take place until after Judgment and the 1000-year rule of Christ. So Camping is wrong there.
2. It also can't be Armageddon since that follows 15 months of rule by the UN and the end of the Federal Reserve and the CIA, both part of Babylon the Great.
3. But the destruction of the CIA and the Federal Reserve by the UN may trigger what we call a "great tribulation" which leads into Armageddon as mentioned in Revelation. So that part might be right.
This is another case of 1 out of 3 accuracy for a date. Take 1914.
1. 1914 is supposed to be the date of the 2nd coming, 2520 years from the fall of Jerusalem. WRONG. Jerusalem fell in 529 BCE so the 2nd coming acctually was supposed to occur (and did!) in 1992.
2. 1914 is also supposed to be the "end of the gentile times", which has no meaning in 1914, especially compared to 1947, which the official date the Jews came out of exile. They established the State of Israel the following Spring. So they are WRONG about that.
3. But 1914 was also recognized as the beginning of the "last generation" which is CORRECT! A generation of 80 years ending in 1984 which would see all the signs and the 2nd coming. The 2nd coming occurred on December 25, 1992 and the last Passover on April 6, 1993. So all prophesied events did occur before that generation ended in the fall of 1994!
1 out of 3 was correct, same as Camping.
So it is clear only the BASICS are important. The focus on the date, not necessarily complete and total understanding about that date.
Likewise, even 1874 is still Biblically significant as representing a generation of Noah, 120 years ending in 1994. Among the JIOR elect, 1874 is considered the time when "Michael stands up" which cannot be academically excluded from his "parousia." So I can say that probably the PAROUSIA began in 1874, that is, when Christ began to become actively involved in preparations for the actual second coming. The "temple in its right condition" was selected in 1886, the year the Bible Students published the first "Studies in the Scriptures" which became the doctrinal basis for both true and false teachings for JWs!
So what will happen when Haraold Camping's "rapture" doesn't take place? Nothing. He and OBVES will get up to speed when I begin to reign perhaps officially beginning December 21, 2012.
That's the key here. Even if they have everything else wrong, but the date is right, it still serves as legal notice to the world and ample warning for the elect! It serves its purpose just like 1874 and 1914 did. That's how Jehovah is doing it, so we have to go with it. He is not making any overtures either to prove to anyone but the elect that I'm the true messiah, but no one can say I didn't admit it when asked. If I tell you I'm the messiah and you don't believe me, that's not my problem, is it?
LS
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Larsinger58
COMING EVENTS PER BIBLE PROPHECY:
The light and understanding of the secrets of Daniel would be revealed during the end times, particularly just before Armageddon. So is May 2011 is a new date to look at, certainly we should have understanding of some of the things in Daniel. We do.
FOUR BEASTS: First, the four beasts are contemporary. They represent Japan (Lion), Russia (Bear), US + allies (Leopard with power indeed, the hands-down great military superpower!), and the FOURTH BEAST which is not like the others but yields great influence, later destroyed by fire. This fourth beast is "Babylon the Great." BTG in modern understanding would be the "Illuminati", Freemasonry and other cults linked to the ancient Mysteries, like "Skull and Bones." There is plenty relating to this on the net and YouTube. BTG jumps on the back of the U.N. when it first appears and we see that through the CFR, Bilderbergers, IMF and in particular the Federal Reserve. These institutions clearly are very connected and influencial of the UN as the Bible prophesied.
But the Bible says the beast would get tired of BTG, would expose all her secrets and burn her with fire and all the merchants would mourn her loss of wealth. So this is clearly the situation we have here where the international banks and Wall Street are bankrupting the world and use money to influence the world economy. The staged economic meltdown was nothing more than a robbery. But BTG would not remain popular with the UN. Thus we already see those calling for the end of the Federal Reserve! So the stage is set for BTG to soon be demolished and all the wealth of international bankers will be confiscated.
But of critical note is the "little horn" that does so much damage with great cunning. It is described as having lots of eyes, which means surveillance and knowledge. That is precisely a description of the CIA, which we know sponsors many black-op operations that topple governments, buys and sells arms and creates drug markets. It is a very effective entity. We also know that it was created by "Skull and Bones", another Illuminati-BTG institution. Thus the Bible represents this little horn as an agency of BTG and not the UN or any government. So when the Federal Reserve goes, it looks like the CIA will be dismantled as well. This is when the UN will take over world government for "a time and a season" which is a year and 3 months, though this could be "cut short" like the first "great tribulation" which was the Holocaust. Parallels in the Bible usually repeat.
I'll let everyone speculate as to what might happen or what we should expect when these prophecies come true. What is important is to recognize when this happens where we are in the Biblical prophecy timeline. Simply put, when the UN takes over world government and all the nations including US give up their sovereignty, then we can reliably count 15 months until Armageddon begins. This is be a very clear sign.
It would seem another "great tribulation" will likely occur when BTG is destroyed, likely in the context of another economic meltdown which could be triggered by anything at this point. But the point just before Armageddon will be the time when the UN will be saying "peace and security", which is already one of Barack Obama's catch phrases!! Obama is already president of the Security Council at the UN so it would seem clear the UN comes to his aid when the next economic and political crisis occurs.
Of course, one of the first things that will go is freedom of speech and freedom of assembly, with lots of intellectuals being locked up, as usual. For sure the internet will have to be shut down and open discussion boards like this will be a thing of the past. So will YouTube. So the intercommunication will suddenly come to a stand still. But this is consistent with Jehovah's Day being a day of DARKNESS and THICK GLOOM. Meaning the light available now will not be available any more. Obama has recognized the danger of the internet and has already put into place measures where the government in case of emergency can shut the internet down.
We are on the brink of a "new age." How appropriate if it is Jehovah's will to have his kingdom in place by December 21, 2012 so that things on the earth will celebrate a "new age" for the solar system. Don't forget, the Mayan calendar is based on 144,000 days!! That seems to me to be hardly a coincidence. It suggests a "new day" and a new age for the 144,000!
LS
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Larsinger58
MORE UPDATES:
Of course, the first "great tribulation" slated for 7-years between 1940-1947 did occur. That was the Holocaust.
Following this the State of Israel was supposed to be set up. That was done in the Spring of 1948. The messiah was supposed to be "close at the doors" at this point. That was fulfilled when the pre-messiah was born in January 1950. Jesus Christ at the 2nd coming takes up the body and identity of one of his followers who turns out to live the life of the "prodigal son." Thus he dies during his 40-year test period, spiritually speaking and his theme is that of a carcass and dead messiah.
The actual transmigration occurs 45 years after the Jews come out of exile, which ends the 1290 days, thus 45 years after 1947.
The second coming did take place on December 25, 1992.
But the FIRST RESURRECTION must occur before then. This has indeed taken place. The 1st resurrection involves planting "seeds" into corrupted bodies, that is, imperfect bodies (read 1 Corinthians 15). Only these bodies are living bodies of modern elect. This makes the 1st resurrection invisible and it solves the problem of language and cultural gaps. Those resurrected or implanted into living elect have an immediate access to the modern world and modern language and all the history from when they were alive until now. It's brilliant! I hapen to know two resurrected ones in the bodies of someone I know personally. That is, I know the new identities of Peter and Daniel!
1992 was the second coming.
1994 ended the "last generation" of 1914-1994, 80 years.
1996 ends the COVENANT for both Jews and JWs. That is, if you count from 36 CE periods of 490 years, a 70th week ends in 1996. These are covenant weeks.
Now everything is geared toward the elect, which is 144,000 natural Jews making up 1/10th of the entire number (Isa 6:13). This means the total number finally sealed is 10 x 144K which is 1,440,000. Now doesn't that make more sense than a mere 144K? Of course.
So many major prophecies have been checked off. Satan was only supposed to be in the earth for a "short while" as he prepares the nations for Armageddon while Christ's angels go and seal the elect. It will be 20 years since the second coming in December of 2012. 20 years is half a generation so Biblically still a "short while." So we shall see. We know from Scripture Jehovah would drag it out to the very last minute, warning us that it might seem "delayed" but it would "not be LATE!" (Hab 2). The fact is, the longer Jehovah waits and delays Armageddon the more last-minute stragglers might get marked to survive Armageddon. So there is no spiritual gain for rushing Armageddon at this point. It will definitely occur at a delayed but not "late" moment.
But many are calling for the end of the Federal Reserve which means the end of BTG influence over the UN, so we are getting close. We are clearly on the brink of another national economic crisis. Countries and cities and states are having money issues and going bankrupt. It's a deep hole we all know cannot be fixed without something drastic occurring. In the meantime, there are already FEMA camps set up to deal with the impending martial law that must be imposed when the UN takes over.
So it is happening, just as the Bible prophesied!! But it is important to recognize these wents and what they mean in the context of Bible prophecy. Many won't of course, as Jehovah's day is a day of gloom and darkness. So my posting days are numbered, so are the posting days of free thinkers on the internet!!
Hope the update helps.
I witnessed the "battle in heaven" as well as had an intervie with Jehovah when I became the messiah. So if it means anything, God is real and the Bible is true. Also the "sign of the son of man" that was promised to appear has appeared and I have a photograph of it, so it is ALL reall. The WTS clearly knows about it because it appears in their cryptic artwork in the Revelation Book. Too much to explain now. Let the DARKNESS begin as far as I'm concerned. I've preached and posted all this time. No one can say they didn't have a chance to learn the truth.
LS
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villabolo
Larsinger58: "Of course, the first "great tribulation" slated for 7-years between 1940-1947 did occur. That was the Holocaust."
It's nice that you correct these "prophets" on the things in which they're wrong. Makes me wonder if you are wrong on anything (everything?).
The holocaust ended in 1945. That's when the concentration camps where liberated by the Allies.
You may return back to your regularly scheduled program.
Villabolo