Anti-cult Act passed in Argentina

by dgp 18 Replies latest social current

  • Band on the Run
    Band on the Run

    I'm an American lawyer writing my writing sample about our Establishment Clause, which bars govt. religion. Earlier, I asked to be kept abreast of any international developments b/c I want to cite to foreign countries as a contrast to highlight the biases of our norm. Someone did pm me, Thank you.

    I particularly liked the explanation for the divurgence in attitude. So would you say the modern const'ns are an anticlerical reaction against reactionary right wing govts. or is that phrasing it too boldly?

  • Spade
    Spade

    Good luck banning a religion that doesn't intervene in politics in developed nations as that just doesn't happen. Argentina is the second largest country in South America (major cocain manufacturer). Their policies produce the fruit of corruption. Your allegiance is to nations with corrupt regimes.

  • Band on the Run
    Band on the Run

    What is Argentina's current governmental form? Peron - Don't Cry for Me, Argentina. Patti Lupone was better than Madonna in the role.

  • Curtains
    Curtains

    from my layperson's perspective it sounds like a very broad educational act more than anything else. The specifics seem to be aimed at the psychological ramifications stemming from physical violence perpetrated by cults and from the threat of physical violence. I cannot see how this would infringe freedom of religion or impact Jehovahs witnesses. (edit to add: I would be very interested in hearing your thoughts on this band on the run (curtains - extending an olive branch to band on the run)

    Also our conception of cult and their conception of cult are also probably very different. It would be interesting to find out more

    Another thing is that an educational program aimed at curbing the sorts of cults that flourish in Argentina may cause people to turn to a seemingly more benign form of worship -like Jehovahs witnesses

    edit: but I'm all for education so this act is great. However as Acts and laws are ususally a last resort one can only wonder at the atrocities already committed by these cults in Argentina

  • dgp
    dgp

    Here's another article that will help clarify a few points, I believe. Again, my translation.

    You'll notice that some of the text is the same as in a previous article. I translated from scratch (no cutting and pasting here).

    The source is http://www.puntal.com.ar/notiPortal.php?id=64266.

    I will paste the English translation first, and then the Spanish original.

    Cult victims now have an act to protect them.

    The Unicameral legislature just passed it. One of the authors, María Amelia Chiofalo, said that municipalities may now abide by this Act.

    Cult victims include people who have undergone severe patrimonial losses, and also people whose sexual integrity and freedom were violated, and some who were even induced to commit suicide.

    These people and their relatives are in the most absolute helplessness before the actions of these psychological manipulation groups, because most of the time these organizations pose as religions and do not come across any opposition whatsoever to enter and expand in a country where the most absolute freedom of religion exists but, at the same time there is no legislation to control [these groups].

    Cordoba legislators María Amelia Chiofalo and Nadia Fernández took note of this. They wrote a draft to create a Provincial Program for Prevention and Assistance to Victims of Groups Using Psychological Manipulation Techniques.

    Last Wednesday, the legislature discussed the draft and turned it into an Act, the first of its kind in the country [Argentina].

    Chiofalo thinks this is the first step towards a wider Act that would include a strict control of cults, which must necessarily be prepared by national legislators.

    She clarified that this new Act does not interfere with freedom of religion or belief. Freedom of religion and belief is fully protected, pursuant to Article 14 of the [Argentine] Constitution and Articles 5 and 6 of the Constitution of the Province (State) of Córdoba. "[The Act] respects every belief, no matter how weird. That is not what we question. What we're dealing with here is only and exclusively the fact that these groups use manipulation methods, which methods have a specific effect, namely destroying or severely damaging the personality of the faithful, or severely damaging the faithful by severing love and social ties with their families. They also make the faithful come into conflict with society because often the idea is that the guru's law is a higher law, or is above the government law. In a democratic nation, this violates the fundamental human rights of the faithful or those in the faithful's social surroundings, and it also attempts against the legal framework", she said.

    She emphasized that, while it is true that these groups take advantage of freedom of religion to carry out anti-ethical and illegal activities, each individual is free to believe as he or she pleases. "That is not what we're questioning. [What we're questioning is] the fact that, by virtue of beliefs, people use techniques that tend to destroy the personality of the faithful to dominate him or her. At that point, we're talking about groups using psychological manipulation techniques".

    The legislator pointed out that the mistaken belief exists that only a new sect with a different philosophy or religion can be a cult, and that is not the case. "Let's have a look at the great religions, such as Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism. Is it possible that cults arise within them? For example, let's talk about the religion of most Argentines. Can we say that the Opus Dei is a cult? Can we say that the Legionnaires of Christ is a cult? Of course a cult can arise within the Catholic Church. But the heart of the matter is the facts, and facts need to be proved. For as long as we do not have a national legal framework, this kind of matters will be dealt with in the judiciary. For example, the Argentine judiciary already ruled that the Children of God are a cult, and they are banned [here]; it has also ruled that the group of female followers of reverend Moon is a cult, and so they are banned. [The Argentine judiciary] has also banned the Eight Queens cult because of their [practices of] serfdom and coercion, and aggravated torments.

    We do not go there. What we want is that the people are aware of the methods used by different groups to recruit people, indoctrinate them, and keep them inside.

    What are those methods?

    Experts in Spain and, above all, in France, indicate that mind control techniques are widely used. For example, hypnosis is often used for therapeutic purposes, but if you use it to increase a person's vulnerability, that is, to program this person, you're using a depersonalization technique. We did a lot of research and worked with experts in the field, plus we discussed the background of other legal frameworks. We also took advantage of the work done by Alfredo Sileta and academics from other countries.

    Precisely, at one time Sileta said the Universal Church was a cult, yet that church has grown exponentially. One wonders what kind of control can possibly be exercised over these organizations if our legal framework is so permissive.

    The thing is, the legislation does not exist. We would need legislation to create the legal framework to deal with this issue. What we have created in our province (state) does not go beyond a program to prevent and assist the victims of groups using psychological manipulation techniques. We want to get the government to do prevention work. How? Through information campaigns. By creating interdisciplinary teams to assist victims and people related to them. by creating the possibility that [the victims] can also be assisted by other groups and by NGOs working in the field. This is a very basic, yet very important task, for the benefit of the public at large.

    Will assistance to the victims be limited to the Cordoba, the capital city of this state?

    No. One of the articles provides for the adhesion of municipalities and communities through agreements with the Ministry of Justice, which would be the executing organization.

    Can this be actually put into practice in the short term?

    I believe so. We need to organize the campaigns first, but it is perfectly possible to get started.

    The Spanish original:

    Las víctimas de sectas ya tienen una ley que las proteja

    Acaba de aprobarla la Unicameral. Una de las autoras, María Amelia Chiofalo, dijo que los municipios ya pueden adherirse a la norma

    Entre las víctimas de sectas hay quienes han sufrido severas pérdidas patrimoniales, también quienes vieron vulnerada su integridad sexual, su libertad e incluso han llegado a ser inducidos al suicidio.

    Estas personas y sus familiares se encuentran en la más completa indefensión respecto del accionar de estos grupos de manipulación psicológica porque la mayoría de las veces las organizaciones se escudan detrás de una religión y no encuentran oposición alguna para instalarse y expandirse en un país donde por un lado existe la más amplia libertad de culto pero, a la vez, no hay una legislación que las controle.

    De eso tomaron nota las legisladoras cordobesas María Amelia Chiofalo y Nadia Fernández. Ellas elaboraron un proyecto para que se cree un Programa Provincial de Prevención y Asistencia a las Víctimas de Grupos que usan Técnicas de Manipulación Psicológica.

    El miércoles pasado, la Legislatura acompañó ese proyecto y lo convirtió en ley, la primera de esas características en el país.

    Para Chiofalo, es un primer paso hacia una norma más abarcativa que contemple un estricto control de las sectas y que, necesariamente, deberá ser elaborada por los legisladores nacionales.

    Aclaró que la flamante ley no se inmiscuye con la libertad de culto y de creencias. La libertad religiosa y de culto está totalmente preservada, así lo establece el artículo 14 de la Constitución Nacional y la Constitución Provincial en sus artículos 5 y 6. “Se respeta cualquier tipo de creencia por más extraña que sea. Aquí no se cuestiona eso, se trata única y exclusivamente de los métodos que utilizan estos grupos de manipulación y esos métodos tienen un efecto preciso que es el de destruir la personalidad del adepto o dañarla severamente cortando lazos afectivos, sociales con su entorno familiar y también lo hace entrar en conflictividad con la sociedad porque muchas veces se plantea que la ley del gurú es superior o está por encima de la ley del estado. Eso en un estado democrático vulnera derechos humanos fundamentales de los adeptos o de su entorno social y también está vulnerando el ordenamiento jurídico”, dijo.

    Recalcó que, si bien es cierto que estos grupos utilizan o se escudan detrás de esa libertad religiosa para realizar actividades antiéticas y antijurídicas, cada quien tiene la libertad de creer en lo que estime conveniente. “Eso no entra en nuestro cuestionamiento pero cuando, en virtud de una determinada creencia, utilizamos técnicas que tienden a destruir la personalidad del adepto para poder dominarlo ahí sí ya comenzamos a hablar de grupos de manipulación psicológica”.

    La legisladora señaló que existe la errónea convicción de que una secta puede ser únicamente un grupo nuevo filosófico o religioso y eso no es así. “Vayamos a las grandes religiones como el Cristianismo, Budismo, Islamismo, Hinduismo, ¿pueden haber grupos sectarios en el seno de las mismas?. Por ejemplo, en la religión mayoritaria en Argentina ¿Podemos decir que el Opus Dei es una secta?, ¿podemos decir que los legionarios de Cristo es una secta?, puede surgir una secta dentro de la iglesia católica, por supuesto que sí. Pero son cuestiones de hecho y que se tienen que probar. Hasta tanto no tengamos un marco jurídico nacional va a ser una cuestión dirimida en la Justicia. Por ejemplo, la Justicia argentina ya ha dicho que Los Niños de Dios es una secta y hoy está prohibida, ha dicho que el grupo de seguidoras del reverendo Moon es una secta y está prohibida, ha condenado a la secta Ocho Reinas por servidumbre y coacción, tormentos agravados.

    Nosotros no entramos en esa cuestión, lo que queremos es que la población esté prevenida sobre los métodos que utilizan determinados grupos para captar personas, adoctrinarlas y retenerlas.

    -¿Cuáles son esas técnicas?

    -Los expertos en España y sobre todo en Francia señalan que las técnicas de control mental que utilizan están ampliamente extendidas como por ejemplo, la hipnosis que muchas veces es utilizada con fines terapéuticos, pero cuando a la hipnosis la utilizás para acentuar un estado de vulnerabilidad de la persona, es decir, para programarla estás apuntando esa técnica a despersonalizar. Estuvimos investigando mucho y trabajamos con expertos en el tema y con antecedentes en legislación comparada, también retomamos el trabajo de Alfredo Sileta y académicos de otros países.

    -Precisamente, Sileta en su momento calificó a la Iglesia Universal como una secta, sin embargo el crecimiento de esa iglesia ha sido exponencial. Uno se pregunta qué tipo de control puede haber sobre estas organizaciones cuando la legislación es tan permisiva.

    -Es que directamente es inexistente esa legislación. Nosotros necesitaríamos una legislación que le dé un marco jurídico a este tema, lo que nosotros hemos creado a nivel provincial es nada más que un programa de prevención y asistencia a la víctima de los grupos de manipulación psicológica. Buscamos que el estado haga prevención. ¿Cómo lo va a hacer? Con campañas de información, creando equipos interdisciplinarios para atender a las víctimas y sus grupos sociales, generando la posibilidad de que puedan trabajar con otros organismos y ONG en esta temática. Es una tarea que es muy básica pero a la vez muy importante para la población.

    -¿La atención de las víctimas se va a circunscribir a Córdoba capital?

    -No, se planteó uno de los artículos para que se adhieran los municipios y las comunas a través de un convenio con el Ministerio de Justicia que es el organismo de aplicación.

    -¿Se podrá llevar a la práctica en un corto plazo?

    -Considero que sí. Primero hay que armar las campañas pero perfectamente se puede comenzar a trabajar.

    I believe this article clarifies many of the concerns some of you have manifested. I believe that their definition of cult is very much the same that Steven Hassan would adhere to. I can't speak for Mr. Hassan, of course, but that is my feeling. They don't criticize BELIEF, but ACTIONS. I would interpret this as "If you believe that Jehovah will destroy the worldlies at Armageddon, that is your right. If, on the other hand, you force people to stay a Jehovah's witness under penalty of losing her family, then you're damaging people and something should be done about you".

    It is very clear that the legislators are not Catholic fanatics who want to persecute other religions, but, rather, secular-minded legislators who are concerned that the lack of a legal framework puts uninformed Argentines in the hands of cults, and, at the same time, prevents the state from acting. The Opus Dei is specifically mentioned as a cult.

    They sound concerned about how to assist victims, and how to get NGO's and other organizations involved. I can think, for example, of the victims of pedophiles receiving help. Or battered women.

    For the time being, all they intend to do is launch information campaigns. I don't see how that would be wrong. This very site serves that purpose, and I know that from personal experience.

    They strike me as people who have done their homework. I can't speak for anyone but me, but I would see this as an opportunity, and not just for Jehovah's witnesses but for every cult victim. Victims are in the best of positions to speak to sympathetic, concerned legislators to find help. At the very least, it is an opportunity for a young person to leave if so she wishes.

    I don't know what you guys will do, but I will try to get these people to read Freeminds, Silent Lambs and JwFacts.

    The actual text of the Act is here:

    http://lagnosisdevelada.com/informacion-sobre-sectas/se-aprobo-hoy-la-ley-provincial-n-9891-cordoba-t1070.html

    Spanish, of course. This is in a forum for the victims of Samael Aun Weor, who should be known as Víctor Manuel Gómez Rodríguez, a man who claims to be a Gnostic. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samael_Aun_Weor

    I will translate this text when I have the time (I have to work, of course).

  • Mad Sweeney
    Mad Sweeney

    Thanks for the update, dgp. This is Awesome.

  • dgp
    dgp

    As to your questions, Band, Argentina is a federal republic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentina).

    Argentina is now a "middle power", but in the 1920's it was far above Canada or Australia. I think that reducing that country to Evita is a gross mistake. Particularly because Evita Perón was anything but an unimportant person.

    Regarding constitutions, Band, I'm afraid you're asking too much from a person who is not an attorney. There are many countries around the world where freedom was achieved at the expense of the established churches. The government started out as religious, not lay, as is the case of the United States. Therefore, free speech and many other things were achieved despite the opposition of the churches. The mere concept of separation of state and church was a watershed for many countries. We're talking about Argentina here, but you can also include Spain, Portugal, France, Italy, and Turkey. You could also include Libya and Tunis, Lebanon, even Irak. If you believe Ibn Warraq, in his "Why I am not a Muslim", then you should also include Pakistan. I'm afraid I can't give you information about all those countries and all those different legal systems. I can, however, give you the starting point. Don't think that America is anything but an anomaly in this regard. Freedom of religion, which you take for granted, was not to be taken for granted elsewhere. You couldn't even be an atheist. In fact, according to Islam, a good muslim should not suffer an unbeliever to live.

    Spade, Argentina is not a "major cocaine manufacturer". Among other reasons, because cocaine is grown, not manufactured. Get your facts first, will you? Even if the country "manufactured" cocaine to such a large extent, then your one-sided comment backfires. America is the largest consumer of drugs in the world, and I don't think we should take that as evidence of it being a society from which nothing good can come. Would you agree? If you don't, let me remind you that America is the cradle of the Watchtower.

  • DanaBug
    DanaBug

    This is awesome! I love that they focus on methods not beliefs, that's the key. No religion should have to use manipulation or information/mind control to recruit. And even if JWs weren't banned, the information campaign would hopefully make people more aware of those methods and they might recognize them in JWs. I wonder if this could lead the way for people to sue these groups.

    Seems like Argentina is ahead of the US in a lot of ways. Didn't they legalize gay marriage last year?

  • Curtains
    Curtains

    thanks for updating us dgp. Very interesting regarding mind control and manipulation and how they stress that family cohesion and one's place in society should not be violated

    What we're dealing with here is only and exclusively the fact that these groups use manipulation methods, which methods have a specific effect, namely destroying or severely damaging the personality of the faithful, or severely damaging the faithful by severing love and social ties with their families. They also make the faithful come into conflict with society because often the idea is that the guru's law is a higher law, or is above the government law. In a democratic nation, this violates the fundamental human rights of the faithful or those in the faithful's social surroundings, and it also attempts against the legal framework", she said.

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