What Are Their Motives?

by headisspinning 42 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  headisspinning

  I have a question. IF JWs are a cult, what is the motivation of the leaders? What are they getting out of controlling all these people?

  Some motives that I could think of are money, sex, power or sincere belief.

  Although the WT is very wealthy, I don't think the individuals themselves are lining their pockets and living the high life.

  It's definitely not motivated by sex!!!

  I can see the power being addictive but it's divided up between a group that switches up it's members - I can see power being more of a motivator where there is one human leader.

  So that leaves sincere belief...

  I'm not pretending to have this all figured out. I just want to know what others think or what conclusions they have come to on this topic...
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  mrsjones5

  Control is very addictive.
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  sabastious

  I have a question. IF JWs are a cult, what is the motivation of the leaders? What are they getting out of controlling all these people?

  Ok, the Watchtower literally has millions of dollars after expenses (free labor doesn't give much overhead) rolling in continuously. Do you really think that money just sits in their bank account for a rainy day? Not only do they have gobs of money now, they also have access to unlimited tax free money stream. They know that 20 years from now they will still be holding conventions and building kingdom halls with donation boxes.

  Money = power

  If they wanted to assassinate a leader they could find someone to pay to do it. There is a level of existence (or "clubs") on this planet that requires you to be worth hundreds of millions of dollars. They must be part of one or many of these organizations.

  It's about money, my friend, and it's being used right now and I don't think anyone really knows for what.

  -Sab
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  Mad Sweeney

  Although the WT is very wealthy, I don't think the individuals themselves are lining their pockets and living the high life.

  The Governing Body doesn't need money in their own pockets. They have expense accounts and in exchange for merely showing up to give a talk they can go anywhere in the world they choose and stay for as long as they like, eating whatever they like, and seeing whatever sights they like, ALL paid for by rank and file JW donations to the "worldwide work."

  Who needs their own money when you can use someone else's for free and for your entire life?

  Even if they don't travel, they live expense-free in New York. Ever try pricing apartments in NYC?

  It's definitely not motivated by sex!!!

  There have been sexual predators on the Governing Body but not for the past 25 years or so. That we know of.

  I can see the power being addictive but it's divided up between a group that switches up it's members - I can see power being more of a motivator where there is one human leader.

  I'm not sure where you get the idea that this group switches up its members. The Governing Body members are appointed FOR LIFE. They're like the Supreme Court Justices. When is the last time any of the corporate executives were removed/replaced? I can't remember it ever happening. The committee heads are pretty stable in position, too, IIRC.

  They don't exercise hands-on power like many infamous small-cult leaders do over their members but they could. They possess the authority in the minds of many JWs who would obey them to the death if so ordered.

  Also, they wouldn't have taken the hard line they did in 1980 if it wasn't at least partly about maintaining their power.

  So that leaves sincere belief...

  Which is probably the biggest factor, if it is real. Ray Franz certainly believed they were captives of a concept and Don Cameron went on to write an entire book on the premise, which is excellent, btw.

  I'm still not sure. It is so hard to believe these guys REALLY think God directs their Wednesday morning voting session via holy spirit. If holy spirit directed the voting, why wouldn't every vote be unanimous? Why vote at all? Wouldn't they all simply agree on everything all the time? Or is God divided against himself?

  There is a lot speaking against their all being true believers in everything they preach. They may sincerely believe they know what's best for the sheep, but it is hard to believe seven grown men would all be under the same exact delusion to the same extent.
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  headisspinning

  What Sab said is very interesting because my husband was just telling me last night that the WT operates like it's own little world. Rarely does it need to go outside of the confines of the organization - everything is in house - from medical care to lawyers to investors to real estate agents. It's really crazy to think of.
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  sabastious

  What Sab said is very interesting because my husband was just telling me last night that the WT operates like it's own little world. Rarely does it need to go outside of the confines of the organization - everything is in house - from medical care to lawyers to investors to real estate agents. It's really crazy to think of.

  They have an eerie confidence about them, I agree.

  -Sab
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  headisspinning

  Thank you for your comments, Mad Sweeney.

  What I was thinking about yesterday is how if you are a cult but you don't want to be labeled as a cult, then you could just look at all the identifiers of a cult and then cleverly adjust your operations so that you sort of slip through the cracks of the established definition (so to speak). Do you know what I mean? For example, if a cult generally has one human leader, why not divide the power up between say 7 men and keep an air of mystery over the whole operation.

  I'm still thinking all of this through and just trying to get my head around it...
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  free2beme

  I have actually given a lot of thought to this myself. As I do see them as cult-like, but not the extremes people normal expect with a cult. I see them as people who honestly want to do good by God, but fundamentalist Christians that take everything in the Bible at literal face value. This does not make them a cult, as other religions do the same. What I believe makes them one, is the leadership format and way of encouraging reporting sins on one another, extreme personal involvement in people's lives and unwillingness to admit wrongs by pushing forward cover-ups. This last part, of not being fully honest with their people, is due to an addition to the power they have over their people. That point, makes them a cult in my opinion, but is a trait I see in a lot of Christianity.
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  pirata

  I believe that the motives of the leaders are "sincere". Since they identify themselves as the "faithful slave" they feel responsible for keeping everyone in line. They also have the responsibility for upholding past teachings which were supposedly guided by Holy spirit. I can see why they are reluctant changing old doctrine even when there is good evidence against it, or equally valid interpretations.

  That being said, I believe that the concept of being guided by God, and being the exclusive representative for the faithful slave, acting on the behalf of Jesus, has made them elevate their opinions and interpretations above the rest of the flock. Those who disagree are removed for they very fact that they disagree with the faithful slave. It doesn't matter if the disagreement is biblically sound, or if the interpretation is just as valid as the official one because the Bible is not clear on the matter. The flock are reprimanded for having their own personal opinions, and instead must accept the personal opinions of the leadership. Time has shown that many of the teachings can be nothing more than personal opinions that need to change as they are challenged or shown to be wrong.

  Unfortunately, I see a strong parallel with the first century scribes and pharisees, who enforced myriads of rules to keep the common jews in line. As the religious leaders, they felt responsible for ensuring that the common jews did not violate the mosaic law. The became righteous overmuch, and Jesus had to remind them that they made the spirit of the law invalid by their myriads of rules. There was now only one rule: Love.

  I highly recommend reading the book "Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me): Why We Justify Foolish Beliefs, Bad Decisions, and Hurtful Acts". I have not finished it yet, but so far it has been very illuminating. It doesn't specifically deal with religious beliefs, so there's nothing here that should turn off an active JW.
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  JuanMiguel

  Another thing that is often not considered--maybe because it's chilling to some--is that money, power, and even personal influence may not be at the center of some cults. History is filled with the risings of cults that weren't "out to get" anything in particular. We human being can be quite foolish in our attempts to "feel safe and fulfilled."

  "Feeling safe and fulfilled!" This is what a lot of groups in the past and today offer. The groups and those within may be genuine but naive. And yes, even though I like to hope for merit in other forms of philosophy and religion, I know that some are worse than shams--they're outright wrong.

  At least when someone is organizing a hoax to pull the wool over people's eyes and attempt to take something valuable from them, heck, even in having people "freely" hand over things like money, property, power, and sex, in that case there's evidence of at least someone at the end of the chain who is smart enough to use their brain to pull off a scheme like that.

  It's scary to think that people will believe in things that are even contrary to any line of evidence or argument presented, with no brilliance at wheel (not even dishonest brilliance), filled with adherents who will put their very lives on the line if they feel it necessary, and again to do this for something that is not a scheme or a farce but instead something incredibly valueless.

  While there is such a thing as mind control and plenty of delusion for the sake of gain to go around, we can also let ourselves be thoughtlessly blind to realities and red flags and therefore join cults if we are not careful. It doesn't have to be something like a religion or dress itself up like a form of intellectual exercise, either. There is plenty of despair and mystery and lack of control in life to make having the opposite an appealing treasure worth any price we can pay, including our minds, our freedom, and even our lives.

  The Jehovah's Witnesses may be a combination of such factors, which can clearly make its appeal and influence far more dangerous if it were just a sham for money or merely a hopeful mistake.