OK thanks guys, I was not sure if there was a difference between someone who has commited a wrong doing(JW lingo) to someone that no longer wants to be a jw.So it can be both, thx
Quick question, what does it mean when its announced that someone is no longer a Jehovah's witness?
by Joey Jo-Jo 21 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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OnTheWayOut
Because of legalities, they do not anymore have separate announcements for disfellowshippings and disassociations as mentioned. The announcement could come from a member being kicked out by a judicial committee or it could come from a member accepting blood (disassociating himself) or it could come from telling the elders he doesn't want to be a JW anymore.
Lumping it all together, the dubs learn that it is a great sin this person has committed, even if he has not. They shun and assume the worst.
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ambersun
This is a good question. Please forgive me if this is slightly off topic but it raises another query that never ceases to amaze me regarding the different ways people are treated by their former congregations when they D/A themselves. Some seem to manage to fade successfully (like me and Hubby) and maintain a fairly good relationship with most family members and close friends, with just a few minor problems that we can live with. This is despite that fact that we openly celebrate birthdays and Christmas, and have done for the past 20 plus years. We are quite openly no longer JWs but have not been disfellowshipped and as far as we know, no announcement has ever been made at any of the KHs we attended. A couple of years ago we were even invited to a congregation reunion at the KH we grew up in, despite it being known we had not been to the meetings for years!
Yet, I am constantly reading about other poor souls who have done nothing more than fade away but who are treated the same as if they had been DF'd. They get an announcement from the platform that they are no longer JWs and are therefore shunned by everyone. How is the decision made and why this apparent inconsistency?
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skeeter1
It means that each and ever member of the congregation should no longer speak with the person whose name was announced. It means that person is evil and has made it his choice to side with Satan the Devil. If a member were to see him on the street or in the grocery store, there can be absolutely no discussion. The member should look away immediately, cross to the other side of the street, give a wide berth in the grocery isle. Only close family members may contact the Satanic person, and only if there is an extreme emergency. And, only the most senior elders may, if they wish, badger the Satanic person on a very limited basis to see if the Satanic person is willing to accept back Jehovah's loving congregation (puke!).
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skeeter1
Ambersun - you are a very rare individual if you were a baptised member, now openly celebrate Christmas, and are being warmly taken into by Jehovah's Witnesses. Perhaps becuase your attendance was 20 years ago, they forgot that you were once a baptised member?
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blondie
Actually the announcement avoids mentioning either "disfellowshipping" or "disassociation" but they are shunned the same. Supposedly no one knows the reason except the 3 men on the judicial committee and any witnesses. The reason is not announced and stopped being announced back in the 60's or the 70's for legal reasons. This change was also for legal reasons. (
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ambersun
Skeeter, I think you may be right, the way me and Hubby are being treated certainly does not appear to be the norm by this board's standards. I was a regular pioneer (under pressure and not choice) back in the 1970s under the Franz regime, but it was such a long time ago that most of the JWs who are still alive and kicking (apart from family of course) would probably only remember me from when I managed to stop pioneering and me and Hubby took more of a back seat until we finally faded away altogether. Also we changed congregations a few times due to moving house, so that probably helped us to fall below the radar.
Having said that, I am a bit worried about the July 15th study article and if this is going to affect the way people treat us. Is there a time limit on how long after fading that announcement can be made, that ambersun and Hubby are no longer JWs?
Time will tell I s'pose
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DesirousOfChange
Good point WWIT . . . it obscures the numbers voluntarily leaving as opposed to being dirty little sinners and getting kicked out . . . a high volume of voluntary leavers doesn't look good on the books
I always assumed it was just for legal reasons -- such as DF for joining military etc -- but this makes real sense too!
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leavingwt
What does it mean when its announced that someone is no longer a Jehovah's witness?
This is the public announcement that is made when a member has been officially excommunicated.
What happens next?
"Suppose, for example, that the only son of an exemplary Christian couple leaves the truth. Preferring "the temporary enjoyment of sin" to a personal relationship with Jehovah and with his godly parents, the young man is disfellowshipped. ... the Bible says "to quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator... They also realise that the word "anyone" in this verse includes family members not living under their roof. ... Our hearts go out to those parents. After all, their son had a choice, and he chose to pursue his unchristian lifestyle rather than to continue to enjoy close association with his parents and other fellow believers. The parents, on the other hand, had no say in the matter. ... But what will those dear parents do? Will they obey Jehovah's clear direction? Or will they rationalize that they can have regular association with the disfellowshipped son and call it, "necessary family business"? In making their decision, they must not fail to consider how Jehovah feels about what they are doing. ... Today, Jehovah does not immediately execute those who violate his laws. He lovingly gives them an opportunity to repent from their unrighteous works. How would Jehovah feel, though, if the parents of an unrepentant wrongdoer kept putting Him to the test by having unnecessary association with their disfellowshipped son or daughter?" Watchtower 2011 Jul 15 pp.31,32 Click here for scan
"By cutting off contact with the disfellowshipped or disassociated one, you are showing that you hate the attitudes and actions that led to that outcome. However, you are also showing that you love the wrongdoer enough to do what is best for him or her. Your loyalty to Jehovah may increase the likelihood that the disciplined one will repent and return to Jehovah." Watchtower 2011 Feb 15
"Is strict avoidance really necessary? Yes for several reasons. ... In other cases, the disfellowshipped relative may be living outside the immediate family circle and home. Although there might be a need for limited contact on some rare occasion to care for a necessary family matter, any such contact should be kept to a minimum."Keep Yourself in God's Love (2008) pp.207,208
"What about speaking with a disfellowshipped person? While the Bible does not cover every possible situation, 2 John 10 helps us to get Jehovah's view of matters: "If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, never receive him into your homes or say a greeting to him." Commenting on this, The Watchtower of September 15, 1981, page 25, says: "A simple 'Hello' to someone can be the first step that develops into a conversation and maybe even a friendship. Would we want to take that first step with a disfellowshipped person?" Indeed, it is just as page 31 of the same issue of The Watchtower states: "The fact is that when a Christian gives himself over to sin and has to be disfellowshipped, he forfeits much: his approved standing with God; . . . sweet fellowship with the brothers, including much of the association he had with Christian relatives."? Cooperating with the Scriptural arrangement to disfellowship and shun unrepentant wrongdoers is beneficial. It preserves the cleanness of the congregation and distinguishes us as upholders of the Bible's high moral standards. (1 Pet. 1:14-16) It protects us from corrupting influences. (Gal. 5:7-9) It also affords the wrongdoer an opportunity to benefit fully from the discipline received, which can help him to produce "peaceable fruit, namely, righteousness."-Heb. 12:11. After hearing a talk at a circuit assembly, a brother and his fleshly sister realized that they needed to make adjustments in the way they treated their mother, who lived elsewhere and who had been disfellowshipped for six years. Immediately after the assembly, the man called his mother, and after assuring her of their love, he explained that they could no longer talk to her unless there were important family matters requiring contact." Kingdom Ministry Aug 2002 p.3
"Cutting off from the Christian congregation does not involve immediate death, so family ties continue. Thus, a man who is disfellowshipped or who disassociates himself may still live at home with his Christian wife and faithful children? The situation is different if the disfellowshipped or disassociated one is a relative living outside the immediate family circle and home. It might be possible to have almost no contact at all with the relative. Even if there were some family matters requiring contact, this certainly would be kept to a minimum, in line with the divine principle: "Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person [or guilty of another gross sin], . . . not even eating with such a man."-1 Corinthians 5:11. Understandably, this may be difficult because of emotions and family ties, such as grandparents' love for their grandchildren. Yet, this is a test of loyalty to God, as stated by the sister quoted on page 26." Watchtower 1988 Apr 15 p.27
"It is the disfellowshipped person who has made problems for himself and for his relatives." Watchtower 1981 Sep 15 p.27
"Yet, there might be some absolutely necessary family matters requiring communication, such as legalities over a will or property. But the disfellowshiped relative should be made to appreciate that his status has changed, that he is no longer welcome in the home nor is he a preferred companion." Watchtower 1970 Jun 1 pp.351-352
"The wrongdoer has to realize that his status is completely changed, that his faithful Christian relatives thoroughly disapprove of his wicked course and show this disapproval by limiting contacts to only those which are unavoidable?" Watchtower 1963 Jul 15 p.444
"Jesus encouraged his followers to love their enemies, but God's Word also says to "hate what is bad." When a person persists in a way of badness after knowing what is right, when the bad becomes so ingrained that it is an inseparable part of his make-up, then in order to hate what is bad a Christian must hate the person with whom the badness is inseparably linked." Watchtower 1961 Jul 15 p.420
"Being limited by the laws of the worldly nation in which we live and also by the laws of God through Jesus Christ, we can take action against apostates only to a certain extent, that is, consistent with both sets of laws. The law of the land and God's law through Christ forbid us to kill apostates, even though they be members of our own flesh-and-blood family relationship. However, God's law requires us to recognize their being disfellowshiped from his congregation, and this despite the fact that the law of the land in which we live requires us under some natural obligation to live with and have dealings with such apostates under the same roof. ? Satan's influence through the disfellowshiped member of the family will be to cause the other member or members of the family who are in the truth to join the disfellowshiped member in his course or in his position toward God's organization. To do this would be disastrous, and so the faithful family member must recognize and conform to the disfellowship order. How would or could this be done while living under the same roof or in personal, physical contact daily with the disfellowshiped? In this way: By refusing to have religious relationship with the disfellowshiped." Watchtower 1952 Nov 15 p.703http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/disfellowship-shunning.php#treatment
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nancy drew
Remember when the term used car turned into pre-owned car, used car "it's an ugly word" they needed a new word for the same thing.
