Is there a reason to remain a JW other than for family?

by cedars 64 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  sizemik

  I can empathize with those who have a desire to exit, but cannot yet see a way out.

  So can I. When I first twigged that all was not well . . . I had no idea how I was ever going to pull out without major sacrifices. I lived in dread of the implications. Providence, rather than anything I managed to construct, gave me the opening . . . and my family along with several others were able to head for the horizon.

  The thing is . . . many JW's have doubts and questions that challenge them personally to a greater or lesser degree

  For the great majority it remains a personal matter and is seldom, if ever talked about or revealed . . . ie; nobody knows but them. The accountability is no less or more required of those who freely acknowledge it here . . . it's still a personal matter.

  As for the witnessing thing . . . there is a wide range of approach beneath the veneer of going through the right moves . . . you can spend a lot of time doing nothing effectively drawing others to the religion . . . and a reasonable amount of good for those struggling within.
• 

  cedars

  Quendi, thanks for your comments. It's admirable that you are so resolute in the need to uphold one's personal integrity. That's always a noble attitude. I confess to being a bit perplexed with what I saw on the "Sunday Talk" thread, namely elders working "undercover" with a masterplan to bow out in a blaze of glory and take thousands with them. It was almost like they were bragging at their "undercover" status. Maybe they think they're James Bond or something, I don't know. I notice that my questions on the merits of this strategy (as of this moment) have gone unanswered.

  leavingwt, I am always sympathetic to those who feel trapped in the organisation. I'm most interested in why they feel trapped. The family issue is the one I feel most personal sympathy towards, because that is the one that has influenced me most personally. In many ways, it is like having your family held hostage by a faceless maniac. What perplexes me are those that don't have that issue for whatever reason, but who continue to pretend they are witnesses regardless. One reason that's already been proffered is the desire to continue in Christian worship in the absence of any discernible Christian congregation on Earth today, although I can't help but wonder whether such people have bought into the need to adhere oneself to an "organisation" and not simply live as a righteous man and worshipper of God independently.

  I understand that whether these reasons are justifiable or not is by no means a black and white issue, and is a matter of opinion, but that doesn't mean that opinions can't be explained and supported by reasoned argument. By means of this thread I've already learned some intriguing things about the thought-processes of individuals who go on the ministry without supporting the FDS. Though I don't think this is necessarily healthy or advisable, it helps to have these things explained and see why people do what they do.

  I'd love to hear from some of the elders out there who AREN'T restrained by the family issue and see nothing wrong with extolling the society's teachings even though they know the real truth.
• 

  leavingwt

  cedars: Have you read Steve Hassan's first book? If not, you are most definitely the target audience of the material. Highly recommended. It will answer some of the questions that you have.
• 

  cedars

  No, what's it called? I'll be ordering a few books shortly so I might look it up.
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  leavingwt

  Wow, you are in for a treat!

  Combatting Cult Mind Control

  http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0892813113/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

  Over at the JWR forum, the thread linked below, authored by 'Critical Thinker', details how Hassan's book specifically applies to the JW experience. Her commentary is throughout the thread, not just the initial post:

  http://www.jehovahswitnessrecovery.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=737

  Also, you may enjoy this article by Randy Watters:

  http://www.freeminds.org/psychology/mind-control/mind-control-used-by-the-watchtower-lifton-s-eight-points-examined.html
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  Quendi

  I need to read Hassan's book and will obtain it as soon as I can. However, I remain convinced that no matter how difficult it may be to shed the control a cult has over one's mind, the issue at stake here is reclaiming one's soul. I know there are difficulties making the decision to leave this hateful religion. I know one must consider the impact such a departure will have on one's friends and family. But in the end, we are talking about our individual lives. Staying in a poisonous environment will not enhance it. It will do the exact opposite.

  We're not talking about people who are still brainwashed by the WTS. For the most part, those raising questions and participating in the discussion on this thread know full well that the WTS is one of the 'wolves in sheep's covering' that Christ spoke out against in the Sermon on the Mount. So they need no convincing about its true nature. They need to make a firm resolution to leave it behind forever. That is the first but most important step. It seems to me that some who have commented haven't even done this, but instead are thinking of all kinds of reasons they should remain in what in effect is an abusive and unloving marriage. They act like those who suffer from battered wife syndrome. They keep hoping a better day will dawn and all will be resolved. That isn't going to happen.

  Once they make up their minds to leave they will find there are plenty of resources to help them. This board is just one of them. They can seek out professional counseling, expand their social networks, get involved with efforts that will give them a sense of accomplishment and fulfillment, and other things. It is the WTS that wants them to think that if they leave they will be left helpless and hopeless. If all they do is concentrate on the difficulties an exit involves, they demonstrate that they have bought into this lie.

  "Get busy living, or get busy dying." That was an important message from one of my all time favorite movies, The Shawshank Redemption. It's time for those who want to leave the WTS behind to take that counsel to heart. Start now making the preparations so that your exit can be done with a minimum of trauma and damage. The resources are there. You only have to take advantage of them.

  Quendi
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  leavingwt

  Quendi: Sometimes, the people you're referring to need help overcoming fears and phobias.Often, they don't even know that these fears are a direct result of WT indoctrination.

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/206232/1/You-Can-Overcome-WT-Phobias
• 

  Quendi

  @leavingwt:

  This board, and the link you posted, is one of those resources I was talking about. I am glad both are available. Still, in the end, fear is no excuse for doing what one must to reclaim and rebuild his life. Knowing this is here, we can certainly point our friends and families to it. We can play a major role in their exit by offering unqualified love and support. I don't know if any of us who have escaped the WTS would have done so without those.

  Yet I have to agree with those who say they can't understand men who, knowing the WTS is utterly, completely, and irremediably false, give talks from the platform or continue to serve as elders and ministerial servants. It is one thing to be in ignorance of the evil the WTS is and so give it full support. It is quite another to understand that this religion is a lie and a cheat and still cooperate with it and assist it in achieving its goals. There is no way that I personally could ever do such a thing. I would have to step down immediately, withdraw from the TMS, and certainly diminish field service participation with the goal of eliminating it entirely. I would not comment at meetings either or participate in their conduct in any fashion.

  We call that a fade. I know even fading can be difficult, even dangerous, for some. But the alternative, in my view, is much worse. History has condemned those who collaborated with the Nazis. Fear of persecution or even death was not believed to be an excuse for it. While the WTS is not as evil as the Nazi regime was, the principle remains the same. If we are convinced that the organization is false, we must not collaborate with it. Serving as one of its officers is a form of collaboration, in my opinion.

  Forgive me, if I sound harsh, uncompromising, or unsympathetic. I do not mean to be. But I have seen first hand what happens when evil is passively supported, my friend, and so have you. Both of us have lived in the American South. As an African American, I know how its culture of bigotry and racism directly impacted my family. That culture arose because those who knew better did nothing to oppose it, and passively went along with it. The WTS, in my view, is no better than those racists and bigots were. We must not support it. We must not espouse its views. And when we leave, we must put an ever-widening distance between it and us.

  Quendi
• 

  jay88

  What you just mentioned Quendi

  Forgive me, if I sound harsh, uncompromising, or unsympathetic. I do not mean to be. But I have seen first hand what happens when evil is passively supported, my friend, and so have you. Both of us have lived in the American South. As an African American, I know how its culture of bigotry and racism directly impacted my family. That culture arose because those who knew better did nothing to oppose it, and passively went along with it. The WTS, in my view, is no better than those racists and bigots were. We must not support it. We must not espouse its views. And when we leave, we must put an ever-widening distance between it and us.

  Is worthy of it's own thread!
• 

  cedars

  I think what Quendi is saying is that, regardless of what people's reasons are for remaining connected to the organization in some way "i.e. fading", there is no excuse for remaining in positions of authority and thereby allowing the society to prosper even though they know it to be corrupt and false.

  I think there seems to be a consensus that this sort of thing is wrong (please let me know if I've misread this), but we have yet to hear from any elders who are doing this as to their reasons why their actions are right and proper. So far they are notable by their absence on this thread, which is a shame! This is the perfect platform for them to justify their apparent double standards.

  Maybe if anyone out there knows an elder who knows the society to be wrong and yet continues to give public talks etc, they could invite them to offer their opinions here? I'm sure we would all be interested to hear their side. I asked some pretty direct questions on the "Sunday Talk" forum, but so far there has been no response.