cedars you can assume anything you want and if you think I am contravening posting guidlines then all you need to do is report me.
The Ideas Thread - all are welcome!
by cedars 54 Replies latest jw friends
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cedars
soft+gentle - No, I'm asking whether you think I have contravened posting guidelines, because that is what YOU appear to be insinuating about my quoted comment whilst evidently lacking the courage to say anything outright...
edit post: the silence speaks volumes
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wobble
soft+gentle comes over as a closet JW apologist. soft-in the head and not so gentle, just my impression.
Keep the ideas coming folks, we'll get this rolling between us !
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cedars
Thanks Wobble - you're right. I've noticed that apologists are very selective with which questions they answer. Ask one a question that he or she is uncomfortable with (or that will expose them as being wrong) and all you get is... silence. I suppose it's my fault for saying "all are welcome"!!
Anyway, yes - pleeeaassse keep your ideas coming in and we'll continue to work on them together. In particular, I'm interested in hard hitting but non-inflammatory content for information leaflets etc...
Cedars
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AGuest
AGuest - you raise good points about the kind of objections diehard Witnesses might raise to counter the Mexico/Malawi or UN/NGO scandals. However, my point was that the Society's FAILURE to mention these subjects in their books (such as the reasoning book) should make these issues even more disturbing to the average Witness.
Yes, dear cedars (again, peace to you!), but I think you're underestimating what constitutes the "average" Witness. The "average" Witness is not looking for a way out on the bases you raise (deceit). Seriously, the numerous unfulflled prophecies should show that. Heck, if everyone didn't get up and walk out over this latest 'splanation of the 1914 "generation, showing them stuff about Mexico/Malawi or the UN/NGO is going to do... what? I mean, the information is out there, yes? Yet, they won't even look at it, even CONSIDER looking at it. Why? THEY DON'T WANT TO SEE. BUT... if the WTBTS is "tampering" with what's in the BIBLE? A whole 'nuther story, that. Because THAT, supposedly, is their AUTHORITY.
Why haven't there been humble admissions of these blatant errors of judgment?
When has the WTBTS humbly admitted to ANY of their blatant errors? EVERYONE knows there have been errors, dear one. Errors that they routinely explain away. You can't explain away, though, what the Bible SAYS (in the version YOU published!)... versus what you TEACH. Ain't no 'splanation the "differences" in that.
If people want to question the authenticity of documented evidence provided by Ray Franz in his book Crisis of Conscience (regarding Mexico/Malawi)
You mean, Ray Franz, the WTBTS traitor/apostate who the GB consider "mentally diseased"? "His book is slander and nothing HE said in it is reliable." That IS the thinking, isn't it?
or Paul Grundy on jwfacts.com (UN/NGO) then that is their prerogative.
You mean "you want us to listen to ANOTHER apostate? Everyone 'knows' they're ALL liars and slanderers against the WTBTS (and God)!"
However, we need to give sincere people, who perhaps already have doubts but don't know how far the rabbit hole goes, the opportunity to hear about these scandals and make an informed decision on that basis.
Of COURSE! I am not saying NOT to give such ones an opportunity. However, no matter how much opportunity you give THESE... it is not THEM that you need to reach - these will eventually come out, due to lack of faith, if nothing else. BUT... they have loved ones who either make it difficult, if not impossible... who STAY... because they TRULY believe God is backing this harlot! If you ALSO reach THESE... even THEY might find just how deep the wormhole goes! Do these not deserve to know, as well? Or is it only those who've lost their love of and faith in God... because they've figured out the farce... who need/deserve to know? Truthfully, didn't most of THESE leave prior religions because of their revelations as to the false teachings/doctrines of THOSE?
I believe it's a worthy goal to at least get the information infront of people, and what they then decide to do with it is entirely their decision.
I agree! I just think that limiting the "information" to those who are only concerned with the SECULAR lies of the WTBTS is... short-sighted... and possibly unloving. But it is YOUR gig, so...
I personally believe that you can't get through to a Witness unless they have their own private doubts already, which I believe a vast majority do.
I have literally experienced otherwise. I have experienced some who didn't even HAVE doubts... until they were shown IN THEIR BIBLE what IT says... versus what the "Society" teaches/publishes. But perhaps that's MY gig. You asked for ideas, though, so...
It is these people I want to reach, not the mindless automatons who never question anything that is served up to them by the Society.
Ahhhhh... and therein lies the rub. I misunderstood. I thought the goal was to get ALL of them out. But I've got it, now. Unfortunately, my love won't let me choose between those who already have doubts... and those who don't, yet, because there's been nothing shown them sufficient (for THEM) to CAUSE doubt. ALL of them, whether they have doubts or not, are sharing in her sins... and so may end up receiving her plagues. As someone who used to be ONE of them... and so understand the "sleep" they are undergoing... I am glad that I was woken up. Didn't matter by WHO... or pursuant to WHAT - I am AWAKE! Someone... my Lord... cared enough to wake me up! I have a [just a] little bit more empathy, even sympathy, for those who are asleep... than for those who KNOW something's wrong, but WON'T leave.
But again, your gig. Do as YOU see fit, by ALL means... and, again, peace to you, dear one!
YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,
SA
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cedars
But again, your gig. Do as YOU see fit, by ALL means...
Thanks AGuest, I think I will! I do appreciate you expressing your opinion though... live long and prosper!
Cedars
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ABibleStudent
cedars - An email campaign would have to be extremely well written indeed, so as to entice someone to open it and get past the first few sentences. I'm not sure that's possible without being overtly misleading, however I am always open to suggestions. There is also the legal issue of "spamming", although a simple way around that is to say something like "if you object to this email, please email back that you no longer wish to receive similar emails, and you will be taken off our list" etc.
Hi cedars, if exJWs (and JWs) send anonymous emails to JWs (and exJWs), who they have/had a relationship with other than sending an email, sending emails to JW family and friends, like what I proposed in http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/211893/1/Youe28099ve-Got-Mail-TM is not considered spamming in accordance with anti-spamming laws and I doubt that a disclaimer is required in an email. Sending an email anonymously is only required when an individual wants to protect their relationship with a JW. I can think of several simple titles that would peak a JWs' curiousity and would not be deceptive: "OMG, can you believe this?", "How are you feeling?", "Have you checked out this?", "How do you feel about this?", "How do you think about this?", and "Did you hear about this?".
Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,
Robert
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ABibleStudent
I wrote a Letter to the Editor of a local newspaper tonight titled "Letter to the Editor: Secret to Preventing Cult Members from Bothering You at Home" about notifying the local community how to add their names and addresses to the WTBTS' Do Not Call List. If other members of JWN would write similiar letters to local newspaper organizations, may be it would help at least one innocent life.
Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,
Robert
Dear Readers: My experiences with members of the Watchtower began by feeling that Jehovah’s Witnesses (JWs) are friendly, well groomed, and knowledgeable about the Bible, and changed into believing that the Watchtower is a dangerous cult. I attended bible studies and meetings at Kingdom Halls and read Watchtower literature. Knowledge is power, so I did independent research and critical thinking prevented me from becoming a JW. I visited www.jwfacts.com, www.watchtowerdocuments.com, www.wikipedia.org, and www.silentlambs.org to learn more about the Watchtower and its history. I communicated freely with current and former JWs about the Watchtower by visiting www.jehovahs-witness.net, www.jwsupportforum.com, www.exjehovahswitnessforum.yuku.com, and www.jehovahswitnessrecovery.com. I affirmed my suspicions about why some JWs behave strangely by reading Steve Hassan’s books and visiting his website www.freedomofmind.com to learn more about why the Watchtower can be classified as a dangerous cult using Hassan's Behavior, Information, Thought, and Emotional (BITE) control model.
The following example demonstrates how much control the Watchtower has over JWs and their children. JWs believe that they must blindly follow the Watchtower Governing Body even if that Body directs JWs to refuse whole-blood transfusions that might save their lives (or their child's life) and to shun a JW, who elects to receive a whole-blood transfusion to save their life (or their child's life). The Watchtower even encourages JWs to shun their family members.
Sincerely,
Robert (please publish first name, City, and State only) When you are busy at home, would you like to prevent members of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society from knocking on your door and bothering you? Would you like to learn a secret about how to prevent members of the Watchtower from knocking on your door? You can ask the Watchtower to add your name and address to their "DO NOT CALL LIST", which is not advertised by the Watchtower. To leave a message at a nearby Kingdom Hall, enter "Places for kingdom hall near (your City, State)" using Google's search engine, call the nearest kingdom hall(s), and leave a message requesting to be added to the Watchtower's "DO NOT CALL LIST" and not to bother you again. Or, leave a note on your door to Jehovah's Witnesses to add your address to the Watchtower's "DO NOT CALL LIST" and not to bother you again. -
cedars
Hello Robert - well done. I applaud any sincere efforts to raise awareness in one's own community to the dangers posed by cults.
Cedars
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ABibleStudent
Sorry, I'm reposting my letter to the editor, because it some how got garbled when I first posted it.
Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,
Robert
Dear Readers: When you are busy at home, would you like to prevent members of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society from knocking on your door and bothering you? Would you like to learn a secret about how to prevent members of the Watchtower from knocking on your door? You can ask the Watchtower to add your name and address to their "DO NOT CALL LIST", which is not advertised by the Watchtower. To leave a message at a nearby Kingdom Hall, enter "Places for kingdom hall near (your City, State)" using Google's search engine, call the nearest kingdom hall(s) , and leave a message requesting to be added to the Watchtower's "DO NOT CALL LIST" and not to bother you again. Or, leave a note on your door to Jehovah's Witnesses to add your address to the Watchtower's "DO NOT CALL LIST" and not to bother you again. My experiences with members of the Watchtower began by feeling that Jehovah’s Witnesses (JWs) are friendly, well groomed, and knowledgeable about the Bible, and changed into believing that the Watchtower is a dangerous cult. I attended bible studies and meetings at Kingdom Halls and read Watchtower literature. Knowledge is power, so I did independent research and critical thinking prevented me from becoming a JW. I visited www.jwfacts.com, www.watchtowerdocuments.com, www.wikipedia.org, and www.silentlambs.org to learn more about the Watchtower and its history. I communicated freely with current and former JWs about the Watchtower by visiting www.jehovahs-witness.net, www.jwsupportforum.com, www.exjehovahswitnessforum.yuku.com, and www.jehovahswitnessrecovery.com. I affirmed my suspicions about why some JWs behave strangely by reading Steve Hassan’s books and visiting his website www.freedomofmind.com to learn more about why the Watchtower can be classified as a dangerous cult using Hassan's Behavior, Information, Thought, and Emotional (BITE) control model.
The following example demonstrates how much control the Watchtower has over JWs and their children. JWs believe that they must blindly follow the Watchtower Governing Body even if that Body directs JWs to refuse whole-blood transfusions that might save their lives (or their child's life) and to shun a JW, who elects to receive a whole-blood transfusion to save their life (or their child's life). The Watchtower even encourages JWs to shun their family members.
Sincerely,
Robert (please publish first name, City, and State only)