Can someone please help me?

by ruderedhead 26 Replies latest jw friends

  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    Hi ruderedhead. Welcome to the forum.

    You need to be more cunning if you want to talk to JWs. You have to get your message in while their guard is down.

    Everything the WT told you from the platform about how to identify and avoid apostates was being listened to by everyone else too, and every time you forget that in a conversation you will put their guard up and the Watchtower wins. That is why I advocate not DAing. It advertises who the 'enemy' is.

    To avoid making embarrasing mistakes .... don't make statements, ask questions. That way, if you have a fact wrong, they can't accuse you of lying or deceiving. Ask questions in a way that makes them really want to answer you.

    Don't show them opposing literature or websites, instead, ask questions that make them want to research to find an answer.

    If you must show them something, make it something they trust. WT literature, dictionaries, books quoted by the WT, anything on their own bookshelf or WTCD.

    ... and don't inundate them. Just pick one subject that is important to THEM and stick with it. No distractions.

    If your friend will still talk to you, practice a bit of shut up. Make her do the talking. Don't even read her a scripture or a passage out of a WT. Ask her to read it to you. Don't explain it to her. Ask her to explain it to you. Ask questions to get her to realise she is using double standards, faulty logic, psychological abuse, whatever. You cannot afford to make any more mistakes. She will just use them as excuses to trash your character to let herself off confronting the truth about The Truth.

    Good luck

    Chris

  • Ding
    Ding

    Black Sheep's suggested techniques are very good.

    They give you a much better chance of making headway than directly telling JWs that the WTS is wrong about something.

  • Fernando
    Fernando

    Welcome ruderedhead!

    Many exiting JWs go through the process of agonising over the perfect way to explain the error of their ways to blind (Watchtower) religionists. I did the same until it dawned on me that as a group they are irreformable and illegitimate. It became clear to me that their ignorance was militant and their self-righteousness was malignant. They are spiritually blind, confused, inebriated and insane by choice.

    Jesus was the perfect explanation and the religionists killed him to silence his message.

    A possibly much easier way to witness to Watchtower religionists is asking them simple thought provoking questions. If their inability to answer does not disturb them enough to research in the Watchtower library they simply are not ready to hear at this point in their lives.

    A powerful question is asking them to explain "legalism" and its opposite from the heart. If they have a sincere, humble and open-minded attitude and heart they may find g79 6/8 pp. 27-28 and see that it actually condemns this prolific self-righteous and supremacist Watchtower practice, and promotes IMPUTED righteousness instead (a key ingredient missing from the "good news" preached by these "publishers of the good news").

  • TOTH
    TOTH

    welcome to the group!

  • LostGeneration
    LostGeneration

    Welcome ruderedhead,

    Sorry to hear about your friend. You have to remember the mindset of a fully active JW. Quite literally, you are threatening their "everlasting" life if you approach them with too much information, too quickly. Its a flight or fight response that you will get. The threat to shun is simply a defense mechanism used to protect that "life" from the danger she is feeling. I know it doesn't make any of this better, just trying to help you understand why the harsh response.

    Its almost impossible for us to relate once we have deprogrammed. Sending a note is the right thing, simply explain that you love her and didn't want her to hear it from anyone else. Let her know you will always welcome her regardless of her beliefs. Maybe in some time when she has a moment of doubt she will remember you.

  • ruderedhead
    ruderedhead

    Thank you to all of you for your comments! They are extremely helpful. You are a wise and compassionate group of people! Wish I had posted here before speaking with her, but I did not anticipate what occured. But I should have, as she has always brought up WT doctrine/beliefs in our conversations. I will remember all of your excellent advice before I speak to any witness again! It's funny ziddina suggested asking my son to help me. He is a trial attorney, and I understand he is quite good at prepping clients & has excellent speaking skills. But when I bring up something about the Witnesses, he laughs at me, and just says, Mom, you know what they can be like, don't worry about it! He has moved on.

    I did send her a 3 line note correcting myself, I hope she reads it. Again, thank you. I appreciate your help more than I can say! All the best to all of you!

    Ruderedhead

  • tec
    tec

    She asked where I was going to go? To God and Jesus Christ, I replied

    Best answer ever :)

    And the truth.

    I agree, don't beat yourself up over what another person believes or disbelieves. You care enough to try and help, and that is the best you can do. I also agree with Blacksheep's suggestions. Asking her poignant questions and letting her answer them is the best way to get something past the guard.

    Welcome to the forum.

    Peace to you and your loved ones,

    Tammy

  • ABibleStudent
    ABibleStudent

    Welcome ruderedhead to JWN. Don't be so hard on yourself. We all make mistakes, so learn to forgive yourself. At least you had a good answer for her question of where would you go.

    Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

    Robert

  • etna
    etna

    Hope it gors well for you ruderedhead. Its hard to know what to say, but its good to be like them and listen first and not say anything. I like what blacksheep suggests, it helps me.

    Good luck Etna

  • nugget
    nugget

    Welcome to the board. I phoned my sister to let her know we were being disfellowshipped because we would not agree that the faithful and discreet slave were god's representatatives on Earth. As soon as she knew we were to be disfellowshipped she stopped listening to a word I said and became very judgemental. It wouldn't have mattered how fabulous my arguments were watchtower conditioning makes it impossible for people to process criticism rationally. Don't beat yourself up over this it cannot be helped who knows what the future brings it certainly won't be armageddon so there is time for people to change their mind.

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