Give Some Logical Points To Prove That JWs Do Not Have The Truth (page 3)

slimboyfat

They said that the creator "promised" the generation of 1914 would see Armageddon. They were wrong and they made their own God into a liar.

Knowsnothing

My point of argument is that if God isn't partial and is just, then why are there so many religions out there today?

That alone to me dispells not only JW's but, any other religion out there claiming to have the "truth".

The academic dishonesty/quoting authors out of context that I learned about (and later proved by visits to the library) in their publications. They were not only quoting from literature that JWs would be expelled for reading, but also presenting the words of others in a way that was clearly a misrepresentation. If you have the truth, full disclosure in matters of academic research should be a given. Your reader shouldn't check the source and find that you misquoted it just to prove a point. That sort of thing leads your audience to conclude that your motives are suspect and you lose all credibility.

Just the fact that they prefer to tell people to avoid opposing arguments (ie. from "apostates") is a huge red flag. Truth defeats falsehood every time. To say we should actually be scared of a false argument or a false statement is a lot like a boxer saying he's the undisputed champion, yet refusing to fight a challenger who steps into the ring. Well you're not undisputed if you're not willing to subject your title to a dispute, are you? The Society is like a boxer who gets scared and tells his trainer, "I'll knock you out if you let this guy get in the ring with me!" Your title is forfeit, then.

I think the Awake! articles that demonstrate that propagandists (June 8th or 22nd, 2000, if memory serves correctly) don't want you to hear the opposing side's point of view support this point. It proves further that they are engaging in propaganda techniques.

--sd-7

maksym

Comments by Watchtower on Johannes Greber, a spiritist and who wrote a book and translated the New Testament through automatic writing in a seance with his wife.

“Says Johannes Greber in the introduction of his translation of the New Testament, copyrighted in 1937: “I myself was a Catholic priest, and until I was forty-eight years old had never as much as believe in the possibility of communicating with the world of God’s spirits. The day came, however, when I involuntarily took my first step toward such communication, and experienced things that shook me to the depths of my soul. ... My experiences are related in a book that has appeared in both German and English and bears the title, Communicating with the Spirit-World: Its Laws and It’s Purpose.” In keeping with his Roman Catholic extraction Greber’s translation is bound with a gold-leaf cross on its stiff cover. In the Foreword of his aforementioned book ex-priest Greber says: “The most significant spiritualistic book is the Bible.” Under this impression Greber endeavors to make his New Testament translation read very spiritualistic....Very plainly the spirits in which ex-priest Greber believes helped him in his translation.”

15 February 1956 Watchtower, pages 110 and 111

It comes as no surprise that one Johannes Greber, a former Catholic clergyman, has become a spiritualist and has published the book entitled “Communication with the Spirit World, Its Laws and Its Purpose.” In its Foreword he makes the typical misstatement: “The most significant spiritualistic book is the Bible; for its principal contents hinge upon the messages of the beyond to those existing in the present.”

What do the Scriptures say about “Survival after Death”? 1955, P. 88

Therefore even the Watchtower admits that Johannes Greber was an ex-Catholic priest who converted to spiritism. So what is in his book that the “spirits” gave him knowledge of? What did he write about?

Claims of corruption fo the Holy Scriptures-

The spirit who spoke to Greber instructed him in a way similar to the Watchtower, to justify that believers must depend on new teachings being brought forth by, in this case, spiritism and in the Watchtower society, saying...
“.....Later, many erroneous human opinions and dogmas, that do not agree with Christ’s teachings, were introduced. ...But the time will come when the teachings of Christ will be restored to man in their full purity and truth...Moreover, the originals of the documents relating to the New Testament, even when they have been presereved, have been altered not a few places.

Communication with the Spirit World of God, Its Laws and Purpose by Johannes Greber p. 20

The Watchtower also says the Bible has been tampered with by inserting Jehovah in the text over 237 times in which the original was not there in the LXX. They believe the Divine name was eliminated by copyists. They also believe in a concept of "New Light", something that is also demonic in it's use and principle.
See New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures -1950, p 18

The final deception draws people into error-

Johannes explains:

“What captivated me most of all and, I might say, irresistibly, was the clear-cut reasoning and the convincing logic of that to which I had listened for the first time in my life. Only the truth could exert so great influence upon me, an influence from which I had not the power to withdraw, even had I been so inclined. So much of the Bible which had heretofore been obscure to me, I now understood quite clearly”

Communicating with the Spirit World of God, Its Laws and purpose by Johannes Greber p. 29,30

The Watchtowers view of scripture.

The same is true of the Watchtower techniques to lure people into the Watchtower Organization: Clear-cut reasoning, convincing logic (although untrue) and of course manipulation of difficult verses (taken out of the context). As Greber was convinced that he had heard “the truth” so are converted Jehovah’s Witnesses. Jehovah's witnesses are logicions and take scriptures as literal as they can get away with. Logic alone does not lead to spiritual truth.

Careful examination of Greber’s writings to the teachings of the watchtower society that is God’s so-called “channel” .

1. God has a body

(Taught by demons)
CSWG P. 260 says: “Material forms are images of spiritual forms, and since all material things have and shape, so, too, have all spiritual things, and so also, has God.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures p 348 says: “The bodies of spirit persons (God, Christ, the angels) are glorious.

2. God is not omnipresent
(Taught under a demonic seance)
CSWG P. 260 says: “Inasmuch as God possesses shape and personality, He is not omnipresent... ....But as a personified spirit. He is not everywhere.

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures p. 969 says: “The true God is not omnipresent, for he is spoken of as having a location.

3. God has no foreknowledge in the affairs of men

(Taught under a demonic seance)
CSWG P. 263 says: “You know that I am telling you the truth in this, as I have done in all else. You have had plenty of proof of the fact that I am a truthful spirit. For this you have my oath taken in the name of the Almighty, the true God. When I tell you that God has no foreknowledge of the voluntary actions of men, I am not detracting from His greatness.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
WT Jan 1, 1951 p.31,32 says: “Jehovah God knows from of old or from the beginning what works he is going to do, and therefore declares them for our information, as he did at Genesis 3:15. But he does not choose always to intrude his foreknowledge into what his creatures are going to do, but lets them exercise their free will as free moral agents.

4. There is no Trinity
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG P 265 says: “ You teach of the union of three persons in one Godhead, maintaining that there are three Spirits, each of which is a true Deity, but which, when united, are one God as to substance. This is a piece of human fallacy and is an absurdity. There is no union of three persons and no Trinity in the sense which you teach. God is an individual person. Only the Father is God. All other holy spirits are God’s creatures. None of them is the Father’s equal.

(Taught by Watchtower)
Trinity Brochure says on page 31: “Hence, to worship God on his terms means to reject the Trinity doctrine.”

5.Christ is not God.
(Taught by demonic Seance)
CSWG P 301, 330 says: “Christ Himself was not God, but only the first of God’s sons,...Christ was therefore the Son of God, and claimed to be nothing more. He was not the Deity. Not once did He say: ‘I am God’. Not once did He assert that He was God’s equal in any respect.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures Vol. 2, p 52 says: “Thus the Scriptures identify the Word (Jesus in his pre-human existence) as God’s creation, his firstborn Son.”

Should you Believe in the Trinity p 20 states: “Jesus never claimed to be God. Should you believe in the Trinity?”

6 Christ is created.

(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG P. 267 says: “Christ is the highest Spirit which the omnipotent God could create... Christ is therefore not God, as is so generally taught today, but the first created “Son of God”, and, and such, His highest and most perfect Creature.” And on page 301 Greber writing from a spirit medium says: “ Christ is the highest of the spirits created by God and the sole one to be created directly. He was but one of God’s creatures and as such, not eternal like God.

(Taught under demonic seance)
Insight on the Scriptures Vol. 2, page 52 says: “Thus the Scriptures identify the Word (Jesus in his pre-human existence) as God’s first creation, his firstborn Son. ....that this Son was actually a creature of God...”

(Taught by Watchtower)
WT February 1 1991, p. 17 says: “ ...but as the “only begotten Son” he is the only one who was directly created by Jehovah God.”

7 Christ was used by God to create everything else.
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG P 267,268 says, “...the entire spirit-world was brought into existence not by direct Divine creation, as was God’s first-born Son, but was called into being through that Son upon Whom God had conferred creative power.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. 2 p. 52 says: “Rather then a co-creator, then the Son was the agent or instrumentality through whom Jehovah, the Creator, worked.”

8 Jesus is only one of many Sons of God
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG p. 270 says: “Even on his angels God cannot rely, the very heavens are stained to Him’ are true of every created spirit save only of the FIRST Son of God.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. 2 p. 52 says: “This FIRSTBORN spirit Son was used by his Father in the creation of all other things. This would include the millions of OTHER SPIRIT SONS of Jehovah God’s heavenly family...”

9. Christ did not rise bodily.
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG p. 385 says: “Not even of Christ was the natural body raised.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures Vol. 2 pp. 785,786 says: “Jesus Christ....And his resurrection was “in the Spirit,” to life in heaven.”

10 Christ’s appearances were materializations.
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG p. 351 says, “Materialized in human form, Christ appeared to those who had been closest to Him... The fact Christ after his death upon earth appeared to his followers in material form has led you to the erroneous conclusion that His spirit re-entered His former physical body. p. 387 says: “ In reality He mad Himself visible in the same manner in which all spirits do so, namely by materialization of his spiritual body.”

(Taught by Watchtower)
Insight on the Scriptures Vol. 2 p. 786 says: “...for 40 days after his resurrection Jesus appeared to his disciples on different occasions in various fleshly bodies, just as angels had appeared to men of ancient times.”

11 There is no hell.
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG p. 263 says: “Among other things which you teach, incorrectly, as it happens, is the doctrine of eternal damnation. Page 265 says: “Furthermore you teach of a God Who inflicts eternal punishment and you teach of an everlasting Hell. Hell is not everlasting. God is love. He does not condemn any creature eternally.

(Taught by Watchtower)
Live forever in paradise p. 81 says: “Did Almighty God create such a place of torment?... If the idea of roasting people in fire had never come into God’s heart,...does it seem reasonable that he created a fiery hell for those who do not serve him?

12 Distortion of Matthew 27:52, 53
(Taught under demonic seance)
CSWG p. says: “The earth shook and the rocks were rent, but the story recorded in your version of the Gospel of Saint Matthew had risen from their tombs and had been seen by many in Jerusalem is a falsification of one of the original, ...accurate texts, which reads: ‘The veil in the temple was rent in two from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks were rent; and the tombs were opened; and many bodies of those who had fallen asleep were cast forth. Many, who had come from the holy city, did see the bodies lying there’.

(Taught by Watchtower)
Aid to Bible Understanding p. says: “The text at Matthew 27:52, 53 concerning the “memorial tombs that were opened”....these verses do not describe a resurrection but merely a throwing of bodies out of their tombs,... And here the Watchtower supports Greber’s book and insight by saying, “The translation by Johannes Greber (1937) of these verses reads as follows: “Tombs were laid open, and many bodies of those buried were tossed upright.”

All of the above came from Watchtower sources that support a book with teachings in it that came from a spirit medium. Demons taught Greber and he wrote a book using automatic writing or a spirit medium. Demons led Greber away from the Catholic church and Christianity and taught him Watchtower doctrine.

It is pretty apparent here that Watchtower doctrine is nothing more than the teachings of demons.

If you are a Jehovah’s witness reading this you have been fooled. You are under Satan’s organization, Babylon the Great and false religion.

In Christ,

Maksym

Fernando

The truth is a person (John 14:6).

The Watchtower is very much afraid of this person and the message about him (the gospel).

This person has the habit of leading people away from the Sanhedrin (Governing Body) and the Pharisees (ruling religious hierarchy and clergy class).

Watchtower religionists are unable to say:

I am in Christ.
Christ is in me.
I am in union with the truth.
The truth is in union with me.

The Watchtower readily deprecates Christ's spiritual indwelling of the believer by mistranslating and adding the word "union". They tellingly choose not to deprecate their supremacist and apostate version of "the truth" in the same way.

stillajwexelder

If God is so powerful and really truly did not desire any to be destroyed - HE WOULD MAKE IT OBVIOUS - he would not need to send JWs door-to-door
God would not use an organization that protects pedophiles
1914 - lunar this, solar that, 360 days, 365 days, weeks of years, Ezekiel/ Daniel, Revelation - why complicate it. BECAUSE IT IS FALSE
The vast majority of the GB have been Anglo-saxons/American/German - then they have the nerve to ponit out the vast majority of popes have been Italian
In will think of more

chigaimasmaro

hmmm... its tough to know how to start this.

For me, its just the fundamentals that got me. It like modern day Judiasm, you have to accept the Rabbinic interpretation of the hebrew scriptures for everything else in the religion to make any sense. For instance, what is and is not considered work on holy rest days. Some Rabbi's interpret the law to such an extreme that even tearing tissues off the tissue roll is "work". Even turning on or off electric lighting can be an issue on these days.

The same goes for the witnesses, there's very little an average witness can say or preach about that wasn't initially interpreted by the people at the top in NY. You have to accept the "Governing Body's" interpretation of the bible for everything else to make sense. If for some reason you don't , then 90% of the religion falls to pieces in my view.

snare&racket

Millions now living will never die...

Are you ready for 1975?

Sputnik was the fulfillment of a prophecy...

The 1914 generation WILL NOT pass away before the end has come...

"It is unlikely this system will continue past this millenium.."

Are all these teachings TRUE teachings or FALSE TEACHINGS?

Were the people distributing the literature stating these things passing on FALSE PROPHECY or TRUE PROPHECY?

Real easy one this.

00DAD

Truth is not something which only one person or one group of people can possess at the exclusion of all others. To assert that it is, is to treat Truth as if it were a piece of property. This notion is patently ridiculous.

It is also one identifying mark of a cult to say, "We have the Truth, no one else does, just us!"

Give Some Logical Points To Prove That JWs Do Not Have The Truth