IS GOD REAL? HOW DO YOU KNOW?

by still thinking 778 Replies latest jw friends

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  wallsofjericho

  Nope!
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  Vanderhoven7

  Hi Tec,

  << It is such a release, and so peaceful, to simply..... stop hiding from them, to stop denying them.>>

  Yes, grace teaches us to deny ungodliness. We need to live in awareness of our weaknesses. It helps us appreciate the love and forgivness of God all the more.

  Reminds me of a hymn. How can it be that I should gain, an interest in my Saviour's blood?

  And can it be that I should gain an interest in the Savior's blood! Died he for me? who caused his pain! For me? who him to death pursued? Amazing love! How can it be that thou, my God, shouldst die for me? Amazing love! How can it be that thou, my God, shouldst die for me? 2. 'Tis mystery all: th' Immortal dies! Who can explore his strange design? In vain the firstborn seraph tries to sound the depths of love divine. 'Tis mercy all! Let earth adore; let angel minds inquire no more. 'Tis mercy all! Let earth adore; let angel minds inquire no more. 3. He left his Father's throne above (so free, so infinite his grace!), emptied himself of all but love, and bled for Adam's helpless race. 'Tis mercy all, immense and free, for O my God, it found out me! 'Tis mercy all, immense and free, for O my God, it found out me! 4. Long my imprisoned spirit lay, fast bound in sin and nature's night; thine eye diffused a quickening ray; I woke, the dungeon flamed with light; my chains fell off, my heart was free, I rose, went forth, and followed thee. My chains fell off, my heart was free, I rose, went forth, and followed thee. 5. No condemnation now I dread; Jesus, and all in him, is mine; alive in him, my living Head, and clothed in righteousness divine, bold I approach th' eternal throne, and claim the crown, through Christ my own. Bold I approach th' eternal throne, and claim the crown, through Christ my own. 
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  N.drew

  Certainly we don't need God or religion to have a sense of right and wrong and to try to live up to what our conscience tells us.

  I think what I said is we do not need religion or even someone to tell us that God is real to believe God is real. I believe people have the capacity to know God is real and true without hearing it from someone else.

  The original poster still thinking posted whether people believe in God because they were taught to believe or do people believe in God because God is real.
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  Vanderhoven7

  I think what I said is we do not need religion or even someone to tell us that God is real to believe God is real. I believe people have the capacity to know God is real and true without hearing it from someone else.

  Yes Nancy...not wanting to reveal my ignorance, I was trying to breeze by that one. But I'll take a stab anyway and in the process thoroughly contradict what I said earlier.

  Anyone can believe God or god's are real without instruction. Yet nature doesn't prove God or gods. And it certainly sends a mixed message about what this God or these gods may be like.

  But the original question is actually an epistemological one. How do people know (the one true?) God is real?

  Well if God can reveal His reality to Pharoah, I suppose He can to anyone.

  But does knowing God is real necessarily change a person or make a difference in the way they live.

  I'd say. Not really
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  still thinking

  Hi vanderhoven...I have finally had a quiet moment to listen to your next video clip.

  You had some very interesting points about how you discern Gods voice from the false profit or the Angel of light.

  The example you gave of the woman who took your speed reading course stopped me following your reasoning though. You mention hearing voice that told you she was a witch. And then you asked her a question about the book you were reading and she confirmed it.

  I struggle with this being a voice from anyone other than your inner self or subconscience. You mentioned that you thought her make up was a bit heavy and I wonder if you didn't also piece this together by her clothes, the way she spoke, her ideas that came out in her way of teaching...any number of things that people pick up in others body language etc. You say she didn't hide the fact that she was a witch and was in fact quite proud of it. I wonder how many other people in your class also had the same thoughts about this woman and yet they didn't hear it from God.

  I have people in my neighbourhood and next door neighbours that go to Rudolf Steiner School. I use them as an example because they come across quite witchy to me. They seem to have unusual beliefs, they integrate them with the beliefs of the society they live in. Ie...christian countries..they include teachings of the bible, hindu...include hinduism...but as usual I digress. My point is, I can tell quite easily, from their general appearance that they follow that belief system. I can't pin point exactly what it is, it could be the clothing, or a certain look. They all seem to have the same facial expressions to me...I can't quite expain what I mean by that. But they do. A bit like that glazed over look in the Kingdom Hall...THEY have their own particular expression. This is not a voice from God...this is observation and experience.

  Is it possible that some of the things you are putting down to hearing from God are just your own intuition?
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  still thinking

  Anyway if you are still thinking then think about someone whose belief is unshakeable....... is that open minded or close minded...cybejesus

  Well cyberjesus...that is a good question. My first reaction is to say closed minded...but then, if I make that assumption about someones belief does that make ME closed minded?
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  still thinking

  Hi Fernando

  I enjoyed your post emmensely, probably because it spoke to the part of me that would love to believe this to be true.

  I know the very long list of profound and coherent things I am learning come not from me or other humans but from a benevolent higher power teaching me how to benefit myself. I am far from alone, and far from special, in this experience.

  But I cannot get past this reasoning....how do you know this? How do you know this isn't coming from your own reasoning and subconscience.
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  still thinking

  Excellent post JonathanH

  I have asked this question earlier on in this thread, but not as well as you have.

  Why does God only communicate with us directly AFTER we have heard or been taught by people? Why have we never come across people in the past that already believed in Jesus before the missionarys arrived?
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  still thinking

  Welcome Andrew SH

  I read all about Jesus. Ask yourself what did he do, and who was he? Once you know who Jesus was then you are on the way to being able to answer your own question.

  I really wish it was as simple as that. I have read about Jesus, I have had what I thought were profound experiences...and now, I question what those experiences really were.

  Is believing just a choice?
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  still thinking

  Fernando...and Joey Jo-Jo

  I think there is a very real possiblity that Jesus was a real person. Or course I cannot prove or disprove that. But it makes no difference to me really.

  I also think that the teachings of 'Jesus' if they are his....are good. And people like Gandhi and Nelson Mandela are excellent examples of how his teachings can benefit humanity. But, does that make him the messiah? Does that make him any more than a man with great insight? Not all of his teachings are his own. If I understand correctly, many have come from previous religious beliefs.