There were quite a few things Out of Place things that needed swifting out ,materialed demons,Nepheliem's ,structures and technology that would scare the hell out of us if we saw them today and don't forget genetic manipulation expiriments on humans that created so many myths for monsters like gorgons,centaurs etc. All that together with the fact that we are still regarded inferior creation somewhere between animal and angel gives the right to God to treat us the way he does .Yes ,it doesn't make sense and things could be handled differently but that would make a me god ,wouldn't it ? And that is back in the same argument ,who has the right to know bad from good ?
What did God accomplish with the flood?
by jam 79 Replies latest social humour
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Finkelstein
Unfortunately Raymond Frantz, the flood by the hand of God (YHWH) didn't kill those Gorgons, Centaurs and all the other half human half spirit beings
because they were still there after the time of the flood, as they are recorded in ancient mythology and through archaeological findings .......DARN !
Once again proving that the flood didn't accomplish anything as espoused by professing religionists.
An archaic Gorgon (around 580 BC), as depicted on a pediment from the temple of Artemis in Corfu, on display at the Archaeological Museum of Corfu First century BC mosaic of Alexander the Great bearing on his armor an image of the Gorgon as an aegis - Naples National Archaeological Museum Athena wears the ancient form of the Gorgon head on her aegis, as the huge serpent who guards the golden fleece regurgitates Jason; cup by Douris, Classical Greece, early fifth century BC – Vatican Museum Gorgons are often depicted as having wings , brazen claws, the tusks of boars and scaly skin . The oldest oracles were said to be protected by serpents and a Gorgon image was often associated with those temples. Lionesses or sphinxes are frequently associated with the Gorgon as well. The powerful image of the Gorgon was adopted for the classical images and myths of Zeus and Athena, perhaps being worn in continuation of a more ancient imagery. The Gorgons were said to be the daughters of the sea god Phorcys and his sister-wife, Ceto the sea monster. Homer, the author of the oldest known work of European literature, speaks only of one Gorgon, whose head is represented in the Iliad as fixed in the centre of the aegis of Zeus:
- "About her shoulders she flung the tasselled aegis, fraught with terror...and therein is the head of the dread monster, the Gorgon, dread and awful, a portent of Zeus that beareth the aegis."(5.735ff)
Its earthly counterpart is a device on the shield of Agamemnon:
- "...and therein was set as a crown the Gorgon, grim of aspect, glaring terribly, and about her were Terror and Rout."(11.35ff)
Gorgon Medusa 200 AD (Romano-Germanic Museum in Cologne) The date of Homer was controversial in antiquity, and is no less so today. Herodotus said that Homer lived 400 years before his own day, which would place Homer about 850 BC; [ 4 ] but other ancient sources gave dates much closer to the Trojan War. [ 5 ] Those who believe that the stories of the Trojan War derive from a specific historical conflict usually date it to the twelfth or eleventh centuries BC, often preferring the dates given by Eratosthenes, 1194–1184 BC, which roughly corresponds with archaeological evidence of a catastrophic burning of Troy VIIa. For modern scholarship, 'the date of Homer' refers to the date of the poems as much as to the lifetime of an individual.
The scholarly consensus is that "the Iliad and the Odyssey date from the extreme end of the ninth century BC or from the eighth, the Iliad being anterior to the Odyssey, perhaps by some decades." [ 6 ] They are presumed to have existed as an oral tradition that eventually became set in historical records. Even at that early time the Gorgon is displayed as a vestige of ancient powers that preceded the historical transition to the beliefs of the Classical Greeks, displayed on the chest of Athene and Zeus.
In the Odyssey, the Gorgon is a monster of the underworld to which the earliest deities were cast:
- "...and pale fear seized me, lest august Persephone might send forth upon me from out of the house of Hades the head of the Gorgon, that awful monster..."(11.635)
Around 700 BC, Hesiod (Theogony, Shield of Heracles) increases the number of Gorgons to three—Stheno (the mighty), Euryale (the far-springer), and Medusa (the queen), and makes them the daughters of the sea-god Phorcys and of Keto. Their home is on the farthest side of the western ocean; according to later authorities, in Libya. Ancient Libya is identified as a possible source of the deity, Neith, who was called Athene in Greece.
The Attic tradition, reproduced in Euripides (Ion), regarded the Gorgon as a monster, produced by Gaia to aid her children, the Titans, against the new Olympian deities and she was slain by Athena, who wore her skin thereafter. Of the three Gorgons, only Medusa is mortal.
Winged goddess with a Gorgon's head. Orientalizing plate, ca. 600 BC, from Kameiros, Rhodes The Bibliotheca (2.2.6, 2.4.1, 2.4.2) provides a good summary of the Gorgon myth. Much later stories claim that each of three Gorgon sisters, Stheno, Euryale, and Medusa, had snakes for hair, and that they had the power to turn anyone who looked at them to stone.
According to Ovid (Metamorphoses), a Roman poet writing in 8 AD who was noted for accuracy regarding the Greek myths, Medusa alone had serpents in her hair, and that this was due to Athena (Roman Minerva) cursing her. Medusa had copulated with Poseidon (Roman Neptune) in a temple of Athena after he was aroused by the golden color of Medusa's hair. Athena therefore changed the enticing golden locks into serpents. Diodorus and Palaephatus mention that the Gorgons lived in the Gorgades, islands in the Aethiopian Sea. The main island was called Cerna and, according to Henry T. Riley, these islands may correspond to Cape Verde. [ 7 ]
It is mentioned that the Gorgons lived in the entrance of the Underworld in the Aenid.
Pausanias (5.10.4, 8.47.5, many other places), a geographer of the second century A.D., supplies the details of where and how the Gorgons were represented in Greek art and architecture.
[edit] Perseus and Medusa
Further information: Medusa Perseus killing Medusa, from the temple C at Selinus. Archaeological Museum of Palermo In later myths, Medusa was the only one of the three Gorgons who was not immortal. King Polydectes sent Perseus to kill Medusa in hopes of getting him out of the way, while he pursued Perseus's mother, Danae.
Some authors say that Perseus was armed with a scythe from Hermes (Roman equivalent Mercury) and a mirror (or a shield) from Athena. Perseus could safely cut off Medusa's head without turning to stone by looking only at her reflection in the shield. From the blood that spurted from her neck and jumping into the sea sprang Pegasus and Chrysaor, her sons by Poseidon. Other sources say that each drop of blood became a snake. He gave the head, which retained the power of turning into stone all who looked upon it, to Athena. She then placed it on the mirrored shield called Aegis and gave it to Zeus. Another source says that Perseus buried the head in the marketplace of Argos.
According to other accounts, either he or Athena used the head to turn Atlas into stone, transforming him into the Atlas Mountains that held up both heaven and earth. [ 8 ] He also used it against a competing suitor.
Ultimately, he used it against King Polydectes. When Perseus returned to the court of the king, Polydectes asked if he had the head of Medusa. Perseus replied "here it is" and held it aloft, turning the whole court to stone.
[edit] Protective and healing powers
Archaic (Etruscan) fanged goggle-eyed Gorgon flanked by standing winged lionesses or sphinxes on a hydria from Vulci, 540–530 BC In Ancient Greece a Gorgoneion (or stone head, engraving, or drawing of a Gorgon face, often with snakes protruding wildly and the tongue sticking out between her fangs) frequently was used as an apotropaic symbol [ 9 ] and placed on doors, walls, floors, coins, shields, breastplates, and tombstones in the hopes of warding off evil. In this regard Gorgoneia are similar to the sometimes grotesque faces on Chinese soldiers’ shields, also used generally as an amulet, a protection against the evil eye. Likewise, in Hindu mythology, Kali is often shown with a protruding tongue and snakes around her head.
Disk-fibula with a gorgoneion. Bronze with repoussé decoration, second half of the 6th century BC. Louvre In Greek mythology, blood taken from the right side of a Gorgon could bring the dead back to life, yet blood taken from the left side was an instantly fatal poison. Athena gave a vial of the healing blood to Asclepius, which ultimately brought about his demise. Heracles is said to have obtained a lock of Medusa’s hair (which possessed the same powers as the head) from Athena and to have given it to Sterope, the daughter of Cepheus, as a protection for the town of Tegea against attack. According to the later idea of Medusa as a beautiful maiden, whose hair had been changed into
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Finkelstein
Flood myth
"The Deluge", frontispiece to Gustave Doré's illustrated edition of the Bible. Based on the story of Noah's Ark, this shows humans and a tiger doomed by the flood futilely attempting to save their children and cubs.A flood myth or deluge myth is a symbolic narrative in which a great flood is sent by a deity, or deities, to destroy civilization in an act of divine retribution. Parallels are often drawn between the flood waters of these myths and the primeval waters found in certain creation myths, as the flood waters are described as a measure for the cleansing of humanity, in preparation for rebirth. Most flood myths also contain a culture hero, who strives to ensure this rebirth. [ 1 ] The flood myth motif is widespread among many cultures as seen in the Mesopotamian flood stories, the Puranas, Deucalion in Greek mythology, the Genesis flood narrative, and even in the lore of the K'iche' and Maya peoples of Central America.
[edit] Mythologies
"The Deluge", by John Martin, 1834. Oil on canvas. Yale University The Mesopotamian flood stories concern the epics of Ziusudra, Gilgamesh, and Atrahasis. In the Sumerian King List, it relies on the flood motif to divide its history into preflood and postflood periods. The preflood kings had enormous lifespans, whereas postflood lifespans were much reduced. The Sumerian flood myth found in the Deluge tablet was the epic of Ziusudra, who heard the Divine Counsel to destroy humanity, in which he constructed a vessel that delivered him from great waters. [ 2 ]
AssyriologistGeorge Smith translated the Babylonian account of the Great Flood in the 19th Century. Further discoveries produced several versions of the Mesopotamian flood myth, with the account that is closest to that in "Genesis 6–9" found in a 700 BCE Babylonian copy of the Epic of Gilgamesh. In this work, the hero, Gilgamesh, meets the immortal man, Utnapishtim, and the latter describes how the god, Ea, instructed him to build a huge vessel in anticipation of a deity-created flood that would destroy the world; the vessel was not only intended for Utnapishtim, but was built to also protect his family, his friends and animals. [ 3 ]
In Hindu mythology, texts such as the Satapatha Brahmana mention the puranic story of a great flood, [ 4 ] wherein the MatsyaAvatar of Vishnu warns the first man, Manu, of the impending flood, and also advises him to build a giant boat. [ 5 ] [ 6 ] [ 7 ]
In the Genesis flood narrative, YHWH becomes aware of human evil and decides to destroy humanity. Righteous Noah is given instructions to build an ark. When the ark is completed, Noah, his family, and representatives of all the animals of the earth are called upon to enter the ark. When the destructive flood begins, all life outside of the ark perishes. After the waters recede, all those aboard the ark disembark and have God's guarantee that life shall continue. [ 8 ]
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raymond frantz
Finkelstein ,good points and great review..I'm Greek and was brought with these stories There are not archological finds at least in Greece of gorgons or centaurs but the fact they appear as stories so frequently in Greek mythology shows that at some point in the past humans have encountered such creatures .The book of ENOCH makes mention to genetic manipulation also stories in other cultures (India) make mention of vimanas and nuclear bombs in the antiquity .If you put all these together ,you can see why would God would want to wipe the slate clean ,we were exposed far to early to some many things that we were not capable to process .No wonder they left a scar in human collective cosciousness in the form of myths and stories
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Finkelstein
Was the flood of Noah the only singular unique story told in ancient mythology ? not exactly so.
A flood myth or deluge myth is a symbolic narrative in which a great flood is sent by a deity , or deities, to destroy civilization in an act of divine retribution . Parallels are often drawn between the flood waters of these myths and the primeval waters found in certain creation myths , as the flood waters are described as a measure for the cleansing of humanity, in preparation for rebirth. Most flood myths also contain a culture hero , who strives to ensure this rebirth. [1] The flood myth motif is widespread among many cultures as seen in the Mesopotamian flood stories, the Puranas , Deucalion in Greek mythology , the Genesis flood narrative , and even in the lore of the K'iche' and Maya peoples of Central America .
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EntirelyPossible
The book of ENOCH makes mention to genetic manipulation also stories in other cultures (India) make mention of vimanas and nuclear bombs in the antiquity
Oh? where does it mention these things? And I mean explicitely, not with your layered on interpretation.
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Finkelstein
The Mesopotamian flood stories concern the epics of Ziusudra , Gilgamesh , and Atrahasis . In the Sumerian King List , it relies on the flood motif to divide its history into preflood and postflood periods. The preflood kings had enormous lifespans, whereas postflood lifespans were much reduced. The Sumerian flood myth found in the Deluge tablet was the epic of Ziusudra, who heard the Divine Counsel to destroy humanity, in which he constructed a vessel that delivered him from great waters. [2]
Assyriologist George Smith translated the Babylonian account of the Great Flood in the 19th Century. Further discoveries produced several versions of the Mesopotamian flood myth, with the account that is closest to that in " Genesis 6–9" found in a 700 BCE Babylonian copy of the Epic of Gilgamesh. In this work, the hero, Gilgamesh , meets the immortal man, Utnapishtim , and the latter describes how the god, Ea , instructed him to build a huge vessel in anticipation of a deity-created flood that would destroy the world; the vessel was not only intended for Utnapishtim, but was built to also protect his family, his friends and animals. [3]
In Hindu mythology , texts such as the Satapatha Brahmana mention the puranic story of a great flood, [4] wherein the MatsyaAvatar of Vishnu warns the first man, Manu , of the impending flood, and also advises him to build a giant boat. [5] [6] [7]
In the Genesis flood narrative , YHWH becomes aware of human evil and decides to destroy humanity. Righteous Noah is given instructions to build an ark . When the ark is completed, Noah, his family, and representatives of all the animals of the earth are called upon to enter the ark. When the destructive flood begins, all life outside of the ark perishes. After the waters recede, all those aboard the ark disembark and have God's guarantee that life shall continue. [8]
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raymond frantz
Hi Entirely Pssible , Genesis 6:12 says"all flesh had ruined it's way on the earth" .Satan knew that the only way to stop Jehovah's prophesy for the seed of the woman happening was to ruin the seed or contaminate the seed. genetic manipulation would seem to be the only way ,which him and his demons did on a grand scale .Eitherwise how are we to interpent the verse genesis 6:12 ? "All flesh" would include the animals too which were ruined or contaminated from genetic engineering . The book of Jared says chapter 4 ,"they(demons) mixed species one with another in order to provoke the Lord"
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Finkelstein
Here's an interesting video concerning the flood of Noah, focusing on its probabilities upon already known facts.
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King Solomon
EP said:
The book of ENOCH makes mention to genetic manipulation also stories in other cultures (India) make mention of vimanas and nuclear bombs in the antiquity
Oh? where does it mention these things? And I mean explicitely, not with your layered on interpretation.
EP, we got us another real-live Illiterati Hypothesist there, when they launch into Book of Enoch to make such outrageous claims...
Sometimes I wonder if these guys may be active JWs, trying to spam a heavy dose of nuttiness into JWN, in order to try and make everyone appear to be nut-jobs. Heh, I know: suggesting such a conspiracy kinda makes me into a conspiracy hypothesist, too, LOL! Times like these it sure would be nice to be able to check IP addys to see if any trend appeared (maybe I'll fire a PM off to a mod)...
