Just like in another thread a saw, the best way to deal with my JWs is not debating or arguing, but instead posing QUESTIONS for them to answer or not answer. I want to come up with SPECIFIC questions relating to the 'global flood' that completely debunk it. What say you, JW.net?
Powerful questions to DEBUNK the flood of Noah's day
by Black Man 63 Replies latest jw friends
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sir82
Not sure there is a universal set of questions that will work on everyone, but for me the clincher was the arctic ice cores, stretching back 10's of thousands of years, showing a pattern of ice/snow cover for the period long before the WTS chronology for the flood. There is no evidence of a "global flood". There's no way to "fake" that or misinterpret the results.
I.e., "How do you reconcile 10,000 (or whatever the number is) years of Arctic ice core samples with the idea that 100% of the earth's surface was covered with liquid water a mere 4400 years ago?"
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Black Man
How could Noah collect pairs of all animals and birds from all over the world, without the benefit of modern air transport/travel?
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Black Man
Good one, Sir 82!
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simon17
How could Noah collect pairs of all animals and birds from all over the world, without the benefit of modern air transport/travel?
And how could all those animals return to their natural geographic habitat without scattering in random directions, dying and leaving fossils in unexpected places, etc (i.e., why are Kangaroos only found in Australia before and after the flood plus a million similar examples)
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King Solomon
Sir82 asks:
I.e., "How do you reconcile 10,000 (or whatever the number is) years of Arctic ice core samples with the idea that 100% of the earth's surface was covered with liquid water a mere 4400 years ago?"
I know how they'd LIKELY deal with it, just like they deal with any scientific evidence that works against them: "God Dun It!"
The power of God Magic™ is unlimited, and conquers all....
That's why I like to focus on the holes in logic (continuity gaps) in the Flood account, as well as God's contradictory personality traits. The Flood account is FILLED with examples, eg,
God's double flip-flop by REGRETTING making mankind (#1), so he deciding to wipe man off the face of the Earth. So God does it, but quickly regrets doing that (#2)! That's the basis of creating rainbows: God's covenant not to do it again.
So God clearly isn't omniscient (able to predict his response to events) and he cannot make up his mind, so in a single account God violates both his own prior Divine Will (which is a sin; God supposedly cannot sin) and his immutability (God is claimed to not be able to change his mind).
All of that can be presented in the form of a question, of course ("why did God experience regret TWICE? Is God even able to experience a "surprise" emotion like regret, if he already KNOWS what is going to happen?" etc)
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simon17
* Why did lifespans drop so dramatically after the flood? Shem ended up living another 600 years post-flood, outliving TEN generations of his progeny (lol btw). Its not due to the genetic bottle neck because the two babies born before the flood ended up living short lives like everyone else.
* How were all the animals fed? An elephant consumes 700-1000 pounds of food and water each day, for example.
* How did all the animals fit. If it was only a few basic animal "kinds" than how did hyperevolution give us so much variety in just a few thousand years.
* (from above) Where was the room in the ark for potential converts of Noah's ministry?
* How did all these single pairs of animls manage to avoid injury and plague and predation and other problems to repopulate their entire species?
* What did predators eat after the flood? All the animals were locked up and essential to repopulation.
* What did herbervores eat? Many of these animals require extremely precise diets. How are, for example, pandas finding hundreds of pounds of fresh bamboo each day? The entire eco system is crushed, drowned and destroyed.
* Why is there evidence of cataclysmic world events from times past, HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF YEARS AGO, that are crystal clear in geology and fossil evidence but there is literelly ZERO evidence of this event just 4 thousand years ago?
* How did the fish survive? (duh, in the water) -- No! Fish don't just survive in any sort of water. Fresh water fish survive in fresh water. Brackish water fish in brackish water. Fresh water fish in fresh water. Coral reef fish in shallow water. You can't just add miles of water on top of that, mix a toxic stew of waters together and say 'yeah the fish will surive.' You can't suddenly thrust a coral reef thousands of feet below the surface and expect anything (or the reefs themselves) to not be crushed in the process.
* Why do 40,000 years of ice cores and 100,000 years of coral reef build up show no evidence of this (much less survive the immense pressure of being under so much water)?
* Why are you stupid enough to believe a water canopy could exist?
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St George of England
"How do you reconcile 10,000 (or whatever the number is) years of Arctic ice core samples with the idea that 100% of the earth's surface was covered with liquid water a mere 4400 years ago?"
Not sure where the 4400 years come from sir82. As I understand it the WTS long maintained that each of the creative days were 7,000 years long and that man has been on the earth since 4026 BCE, just over 6,000 years.
In recent times they talk of the creative days being 'thousands of years' in length without being specific in how many thousand.
However they do say that it is only since the flood in 2370 BCE that man has eaten meat. There is plenty of evidence of animal remains that long predate the flood that have been butchered.
George
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simon17
I know how they'd LIKELY deal with it, just like they deal with any scientific evidence that works against them: "God Dun It!"
The power of God Magic™ is unlimited, and conquers all....
That's fine. Suppose God did miraculously sustain things. Then why would he go back after the flood and clean up any evidence of it in order to confuse and mislead any intelligence, scientific future generations?
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simon17
Not sure where the 4400 years come from sir82. ... However they do say that it is only since the flood in 2370 BCE that man has eaten meat.
Huh? Flood in 2370 BCE. Currently in 2012 CE. 2370+2012 ~ 4400*
Silly goose.
* Note I did not want to calculate the exact total, because the extremely arduous task of accounting for the zero year is beyond my abilities.