by irondork 20 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
HUH?
Okay, the thread title was a stretch, but not by much.
After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb..." Revelation 7:9
Sooo..... every time the WTS releases it's annual report, it is declaring the total number of Jehovah's Witnesses, a crowd that can most certainly be numbered, as NOT being the "great crowd" mentioned at Revelation 7:9
....in all the years that i was a jw, i never thought of that! Wow thanks!
Nice catch!
I'm sure the Jdubs would have some come back for that - it's only an estimate, for who can read the hearts of millions of others. You know how they can "tack" their way out of a proper solid answer.
Technically, their teaching is that the "great crowd" is made up of those who survive Armageddon. Therefore, the body of JWs at any given moment before Armageddon is not the "great crowd," since many current JWs may die or prove unfaithful before Armageddon comes. Also, some of the current membership of the JWs are among those professing to be of the anointed, so they would also not be part of the "great crowd." Since the end is always 'any minute now,' we should be able to presume a close correspondence between the current body of JWs with the earthly hope and the "great crowd," but the two are not identical. Since no one actually knows who will and will not survive Armageddon, it's true from their viewpoint that no man can number the "great crowd."
The "great crowd" is a small subset of the "other sheep" It is only those "other sheep" who survive the great tribulation. The Revelation book actually states that they are the "firstfruits" of the "other sheep" (p. 203) Those of the "great crowd" who who die prior to Armageddon lose their status as "prospective members" of the "great crowd" and are relagated to the much larger group of "other sheep" who are resurrected. JW literature doesn't deal with this often, but when it does, it is very clear:
"All those making up the "great crowd" of Revelation 7:9 are "other sheep," but not all of the "other sheep" of John 10:16 constitute a part of the "great crowd." These terms are not wholly synonymous." (The Watchtower September 1 1966 pp. 543,544)
"Now, what can be said about the identity of the "great crowd" mentioned at Revelation 7:9? Well, look at verse 13 and the question, "Who are they and where did they come from?" We find the answer at Revelation 7:14: "These are the ones that come out of the great tribulation." So the "great crowd" is composed of those who come out of, or survive, the great tribulation. As verse 17 says, they will be ‘guided to fountains of waters of life’ on earth.
Understandably, though, for these to survive the approaching great tribulation, they must earlier have washed their robes in the blood of the Lamb, becoming true worshipers. Hence, though Revelation 7:9 is describing this crowd after the tribulation, we may apply the term "great crowd" to all with earthly hopes who are rendering Jehovah sacred service now, just before the great tribulation breaks out with the nations’ attack on false religion.
In summary, we might remember "other sheep" as the broader term, encompassing all of God’s servants having the hope of living forever on earth. It includes the more limited category of sheeplike ones today who are being gathered as a "great crowd" with the hope of living right through the impending great tribulation. Most of those loyal Christians alive today are of the "other sheep," and they are part of the "great crowd" as well." (The Watchtower April 15, 1995 p. 31)
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/205271/2/When-did-the-other-sheep-class-begin-to-form
Also what puzzles me is why they don't read further in the chapter at verse 11 where it says that the angels, elders and 4 living creatures were also 'before the throne', so that means either the GC are in heaven or the angels etc, are on the earth. Rev 19:1 says that the GC is in heaven. Why do they not see it? Is it the usual thing of twisiting the scriptures to fit their doctrine?
tornapart, the WTS defines that you can be before the throne on earth as well as in heaven. They "explain" that as the earth being god's footstool before the throne.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/bible/140028/1/Wheres-the-Great-Crowd
Sooo..... every time the WTS releases it's annual report, it is declaring the total number of Jehovah's Witnesses, a crowd that can most certainly be numbered, as NOT being the "great crowd" mentioned at Revelation 7:9
Ahhh... pretty clever ;)
Peace,
tammy
In the JW religion, NOTHING in Revelation is literal except for the number 144,000.
No one can explain this, but that is just the way it is.
Unless they decide to change it.
