A really ugly warning to all JW's

by Mindchild 40 Replies latest jw friends

  • Mindchild
    Mindchild

    Amccullough replied:

    So according to your way of thought, we should avoid high rises, driving cars, or anything else that may increase the chance of death.
    It seems pretty obvious to me that my example was one of showing a degree of risk that was acceptable behavior, but maybe you missed that. Some people think that when the Government gives warnings about terrorists attacks being more likely (and if you read any types of news you will see these warnings in today’s news) that it means: hey I need to be more careful and do some thinking before I act but other people are heedless of any type of warnings. Collectively, our culture often heeds warnings after a major disaster (such as 9/11 happens) but fewer people have the ability to differentiate between real risks and standard everyday risks. So, if you want to play Russian roulette, how many bullets do you need to have in your gun to feel worried? You can’t stop all risks of course but you can certainly minimize being put into a situation that becomes dangerous. I hope you can understand this.

    You also went on to say:

    I really question your motives for this post. You claim that it is out of sincerity and you would hate to see all these people die. However, if this is the case, shouldn't you be on a tirade against contributors to heart disease as most JWs probably stand a greater chance of dying from that than a terrorist bombing. You claim to be worried that something like this might have a drastic effect on the rest of society. Yet you know very well that even if your fear inducing post stopped some from attending, it certainly wouldn't stop the assemblies from happening. So your post does not serve your claimed motive.
    Hmm, it sounds like you are clueless about who I am or what I have done. I used to have a career as a professional security consultant. It was my job to access risks and show potential dangerous scenarios. I’ve also worked in the medical field, specifically in microbiology. I think I’m quite qualified to present some realistic assessments of risks. Perhaps you are right that my thread won’t change any attitudes of the dubs towards their assemblies, but then maybe word will filter through to them to be more careful and to look for some potential trouble from where they didn’t expect it.

    You asked me:

    Why would you even propagate possible means of destruction, naming things like spreading Hanta through skin contact? So we can all go buy Anti-Hanta lotion?
    No, because the CDC recommends telling people about potential biological terrorists attacks. They have a website dedicated to the subject of biological terrorism. If people can’t see realistically that there is indeed a danger, they can continue to stick their collective heads in the sand and pretend it isn’t there. Maybe you don’t like it one bit, and believe me it is not fun being “right” about what the risks are because the consequences have a steep price to pay. If then my message bothers you, it did it's job and maybe you can next work on seeing that we are in a changed world and we are likely to see a lot of things happen in the future we don’t like to see, but at least being forewarned is being forearmed. Don’t you think so?

    Finally, regarding the JW security volunteers. Enthusiasm is not enough. Your average JW security guard could be watching the apparatus for mass death working and not even realize what the hell was happening until it was too late. You can have a million dummies running all over the place and it acts as some deterrent but if they are determined to have large district assemblies, the dubs better avail themselves of professional antiterrorist consultants and trained law enforcement personnel to counteract potential terrorist attacks.

    I can just see the dub security guard now waving his finger at the terrorist driving a truckload of explosives into the stadium, and calling 911 for help. By the time the call went through, there would be nobody left to tell the cops what happened. You need people with guns who are willing to use them to even hope to stop a suicide attack. Do you think dubs carry them?

    Using dumb dubs for security is a dumb idea.

    Guest77 asked me about the baseball games. Well, they might, but then any large commercial event is likely to have more security with trained professionals. Terrorists have their favorite targets and their MO is often one of surprise and stealth. If everyone was expecting an attack say at the Olympics...the bad guys would be pretty dumb to go for it in light of the increased security efforts. On the other hand, nobody pays any attention to 40,000 dubs spending several days sitting in an enclosed stadium. Hmm, what goes through their minds when they learn that? I don't know for sure and I hope we don't find out.

    Skipper

  • Simon
    Simon

    Mindchild, have you considered that your repeated posting about terrorism being directed at JWs could be itself a danger by "giving
    people ideas" or otherwise affecting people already unbalanced?

    I think this is a very dangerous topic that should be approached with more caution than it has been.

    There is also the danger that if something like this was to happen, then I'm sure the FBI would want to talk to you! (but hey, you'd probably get on TV)

  • LDH
    LDH

    LOL.

    Let me get this straight.

    You all think that the FBI would wanna talk to Mindchild if there was EVER any terrorist attack againts JWs???

    Would this be a la "The Purloined Letter?" Is the terrorist hiding in plain view, LOL??!?!?!?!

    Just let me say, if the FBI is waiting for some dumb ass to post messages containing veiled threats before that person makes their "Potential Terrorist Threat," I'M MOVING!!!!!

    LOL, what about people like Mad Apostate who NEVER HID his hatred for the JWs? You don't think HE would be investigated because, what, he never started a thread called "An Ugly Warning?"

    Frankly, I hand't even thought about it before the post. But, of all the public places my parents go, the only one that is unguarded AT ALL (even by rent a cops) is the Assemblies/ JW functions.

    Lisa
    Don't count me Class

  • LDH
    LDH

    PS---terrorists don't need Mindchild's post to get the idea to bomb a church.

    * http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapcf/south/03/17/pakistan.church/index.html

    Lisa

  • Mindchild
    Mindchild

    Hey Simon,

    There are two schools of thought about releasing dangerous information to the public. The first, is that some mentally unstable or emotionally violate individual will use that information to perpetrate a crime (i.e. the infamous copycats) and the other viewpoint essentially says that “things out of sight” will be used against us. I feel that warnings should be given and that appropriate action taken to prevent horrific things from happening. Sometimes, nothing works and you still end up having a disaster. At least though, as per the security industry, when warnings were heeded there was positive results.

    Everything I’ve said in my posts in this thread can be found in “responsible” online sites. These range from the CDC (Center for Disease Control) site about biological terrorism to security related websites that discuss vulnerabilities and what we can do to plug the leaks. Most experts say that being forewarned is being forearmed.

    I’m not really worried so much about a destabilized individual perpetrating wholesale acts of violence against the dubs as I am from the more credible threat of foreign-based terrorism. Check out today’s news for the State Department warning about “soft targets” including churches: http://www.nandotimes.com/nation/story/311245p-2682097c.html Your typical patterns for individual loners bent on revenge is different than this type of mass murder we are talking about in this thread.

    As for the FBI questioning me, well interestingly I talked to them in depth back in 1993 when they were very concerned about a book I was writing at the time about the future of crime was giving away information vital to the well being and security of the United States. They won, I didn’t publish it. Privately though, they told me they told me back then that many of them were scared spitless of the large scale vulnerabilities we have in the USA about terrorism (my book also included this topic.) The events of 9/11 proved their fears right. They now have gone on the other side of the fence and have issued warnings right and left and have taken a much more realistic assessment of the way things are.

    My hope is that this thread was read or will be read by those in the WTS and that they recognize assemblies can be a target of terrorism and they need to do more than have a bunch of untrained volunteers running the show. I don’t need to post this same message over and over it is pretty damn depressing don’t you think?

    So, let’s talk about bake sales okay?

    Skipper

  • BluesBrother
    BluesBrother

    O K , Simon just beat me to it but I will say it any way.

    Are you trying to give somebody ideas??

    Terrorism is unspeakably horrible and these "Dumb Dubs " include our families. Knock it off and stop this now.

    Incidentally, security at assemblies is not as lax as you make out.

  • sf
    sf

    The newspapers should not print this? Or Mindchild should not print out textually what the news is STATING?

    Please clarify.

    sKally:

    If man was supposedly created in gods image, then.....holy krap...we're all doomed.-sKallyWagger

  • IslandWoman
    IslandWoman

    Mindchild,

    YOU WROTE:

    "If U R A Dub don’t go 2 anymore assemblies!
    It is possible that you will die. Really."

    WAS THIS A THREAT?

    "This is not a nice friendly post to any active Jehovah's Witness but is something they should read anyway.
    On with the warning..."

    WARNING?

    "Have you been keeping up with trends in terrorism? Have you thought through what a tempting target a large gathering of American’s (regardless of your religious affiliation) presents to terrorists? Is it all hype? After all, nothing happened at the Olympics in SLC did it? Jehovah will certainly protect you from the bad guys right? They have lots of people working at security in the assemblies so you will be safe. Well maybe, and then maybe not.

    Do you think the dubs would be able to stop a terrorist truck bomber (as similar to Oklahoma City) from taking out the convention center? A body count of 10,000 or more people would certainly provide an incentive for terrorists to do this. Do you think the terrorists are smart enough now to get their hands on improvised explosives to fill their rental truck with? Anyone can go down to Wal-Mart or other stores and buy a few bags of fertilizer at a time without making any fuss at all. It just takes a little longer to fill your truck full of explosives that way. Or perhaps you didn’t realize that ordinary barbeque charcoals can be easily turned into a high explosive even more powerful than ammonium nitrate (the fertilizer) by adding an oxidant. Nobody is going to get suspicious about people buying a few 25 lb bags at a time. Do you think the terrorists are not competent enough to get someone to rent a U-Haul truck for them?

    On the other hand, maybe they would take a more clever approach and employ biological warfare this time. Just think about it, thousands of people sitting close together for days at a time in a warm humid atmosphere. This is absolutely perfect killing ground for making a biological attack. How would they likely do it, so as not to be discovered by the dub security forces? It would be pretty damn easy in my opinion. Perhaps the simplest scenario would be to squirt a liquid form of the biological agent on the air ventilation intake system (where the AC draws it’s air inside the building). Then for days at a time, those nasty pathogens will be floating around inside and being breathed in by thousands of unsuspecting victims.

    I really doubt they would use anthrax that is too difficult to make for them. It would be much simpler to use Hantra virus that is much easier to work with and better yet it takes a week to five weeks to show symptoms. Even worse, there is no treatment or cure for the Hantra Virus. Hasta la vista baby.

    A secondary method of exposure would be to expose the common female mosquito to the Hantra virus and then turn them loose inside the stadium. The whole apparatus to do something like this could be contained inside a single soda can, and release hundreds of blood sucking dangerous killers who will bite many victims each. Nice huh?"

    WITH THE WORDS ABOVE WERE YOU DETAILING THE THREATENED ACTION IN ORDER TO CAUSE INTIMIDATION AND FEAR?

    "Have I scared the shit out of you yet, or do you want me to paint
    even worse scenarios?

    Sorry to dump negative stuff on top of you, but I thought you might like to know that you could be the next victims."

    WITH THE WORDS ABOVE WERE YOU ATTEMPTING TO INTENSIFY THEIR ANXIETY BY MAKING THE THREAT SEEM IMMINENT?

    --------------------------------------------------------------------

    You just might end up being the prime suspect if something just as you described were to happen at a JW Assembly. You could also become the inciter of some madman out there who has a grudge against JWs.

    One thing for sure, if my family were to receive anything like what you just posted to JWs, I would call the police.

    Your post was not advice it was scare tactics.

    IW

  • dedalus
    dedalus

    Mindchild,

    I still disagree with you in all of the ways you'd probably suspect, but it's okay -- we can agree to disagree here, I think. I doubt more arguing between us would get us anywhere, and I don't think too much is at stake. It's good, in fact, that we awful apostates have differences of opinion, even if the language gets somewhat intense from time to time.

    Peace.

    Dedalus

  • Latina
    Latina

    Hi there,
    Are you a witness Yo Yo or an ex-witness? I am surprised to see that there are witnesses on here, I thought it was unusual for me to be on here even as I am an ex-witness who has started to attend meetings again.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit