Dear Rev... peace to you... and are you addressing me ("AGuest")? I believe you are, so permit me to respond. Thank you.
Again I ask,did Jesus say he changed?
Actually, he said he would... but he also said that he would say things that not all would understand, for it was not FOR all to understand, yes?
John 16:7, compare to John 16:13
John 14:17, compare to Romans 8:9-11
John 6:63, compare to 1 Corinthians 15:45
John 6:64 and 16:7, compare to John 14:6
1 Corinthians 15:42-49, compare to 15:20-23
2 Corinthians 3:17
No and you refuse to read Luke 24:39.
Quite the contrary, I have read it. Now I will explain it:
When my Lord was put to death in the flesh, that body 'did not see corruption'. Rather than decay, it was 'changed', so that it would not begin decay and thus could enter into the spirit realm, the portion of which is Hades... or the world of the dead. For three days, he went there and preached TO THE SPIRITS there, so that they could put faith in him. Such spirits were those who died during Noah's day and were 'awakened'... but not 'resurrected' (raised up). When he left that place, they returned to 'sleep'.
When my Lord returned to THIS realm right after, he did what many spirits do... occupied other 'earthen vessels'... physical flesh. That is why those who SAW him, did not immediately RECOGNIZE him... until he SPOKE to them. THEN, they 'recognized' the PERSON in the vessel... their 'eyes'... were 'opened'. It didn't matter what he LOOKED like, but that it indeed was him.
Because of their LACK OF FAITH, however, my Lord eventually 'put on' a body that his disciples WOULD recognize, with holes, etc., for THEIR benefit. Why? Because, as they demonstrated when the women reported it, and Thomas demonstrated when my Lord was standing before him... THEY LACKED FAITH. Tell me, if YOU died today, and came back in the EXACT SAME BODY... wouldn't YOUR friends and family recognize you? The only way they wouldn't, dear one, is if the body... was DIFFERENT. But once you started to SPEAK to them, they WOULD recognize your VOICE, yes?
John 10:27
Okay. Now, my Lord died in the corruptible flesh - and his flesh WAS corruptible (which is WHY Satan tried to TEMPT such flesh) - for it was sinFUL (Romans 8:3)... or full of sin... thus IT DIED... (for sinLESS flesh is perfect: it has NO corruption... or sickness, or sin... or DEATH... IN IT... thus, it CANNOT die!). But he was RAISED UP or resurrected in that which is INCORRUPTIBLE, and THAT was placed in vessels, which again were CHANGED, as 'evidenced'... at his ascension.
No where in the bible,not the NWT,does it say that Christ came back as a spirit creature.
Well, okay, not 'came back'. But nowhere does it 'say' he is the Tree of Life... but it is REPEATEDLY implied!
John 15:1
Isaiah 11:10
Revelation 5:5
Revelation 22:16
John 14:6
Genesis 3:22
John 6:48-58
Revelation 22:1, 2
Indeed, it does not SAY that he is the "Tree" of Life, the one from which if ANY eat, they will NOT die, but live forever. And yet, HE said: "He that eats MY flesh and drinks MY blood... will live... FOREVER." Thus, his flesh and blood are the LEAVES of the TREE that is HIM... which is for the 'curing' of the nations, the bringing of them BACK... from death... to life. But... it does not SAY that, does it?
You see, I, too, used to try and 'discern' what was meant and intended by what is 'written'. Eventually, I was invited to and have learned to listen, instead, to the One about whom such things are written... and who SPEAKS TO US... from the heavens.
Hebrews 12:25
Why? Because HE said:
"To YOU, O mean, I am calling and MY VOICE
is to the sons of men. O INEXPERIENCED ONES,
UNDERSTAND shrewdness and you STUPID ones,
understand the GOOD motive. LISTEN... for
it is about the FOREMOST things that I
speak, and the opening of MY lips is about
uprightness (truth).
"For MY palate in low tones UTTERS TRUTH
ITSELF; and wickedness (or deceit) is something
detestable to my lips. ALL the sayings of MY
mouth... are in rightness (truth). Among them
there is NOTHING twisted... or crooked. ALL
of them are straight... TO THE DISCERNING ONE...
and upright... to the one FINDING... knowledge."
Proverbs 8:4-9
What did he mean by this, Rev? That we could rely on ourselves, that we are righteous and discerning, that we could rely on what is written and THINK that we will understand it... or... we can listen to HIM... and HE will tell us what is truth. By means of the spirit of God, holy spirit, which is a GIFT that HE dispenses, WE... can receive the GIFT of that spirit, one of which is 'discerning inspired utterances', or 'knowledge of spirits', a gift I have received.
As a result of that gift, rather than speaking of my OWN initiative and telling you what I think, I tell you what my Lord tells ME... by means of that gift, through holy spirit... and since it originated NOT with me... but with the TRUTH (John 14:6), what I tell you is truth.
To have Him change would not be a resurrection.
That depends. If he is standing there and changes, true. He never died. However, both the flesh AND the spirit can be resurrected, dear one. Although my Lord died 'in the flesh', death did not have a 'hold' on his SPIRIT, as it has on others, and so God 'raised up'... his spirit... and put it in OTHER 'vessels'.
My Lord indeed came in the flesh, and was killed in such flesh. When he went to Hades, that flesh was changed in order to ENTER Hades. How so? Does not the flesh need food... air... water? Are there such things in Hades? Okay, so he could have gone without food and water for 3 days... but without air? The spirit body, though, does not NEED air, for it has no need to breath oxygen.
When his spirit was RESURRECTED or raised up from Hades, it was as he had been changed to, so that he was now a raised up SPIRIT. In order to be manifest to his discples, however, that spirit was then placed in various bodies or vessels, that last of which was also 'changed' at his ascension.
And if there be no resurrection our faith is naught.
Oh, no, my dear one, my Lord was INDEED resurrected... for death had and has NO hold on him. Had he not been resurrected, he would still be IN Hades, with the SPIRITS of the other 'dead'. Yes?
And since you believe He came as a ghost there is no God within you as Romans 8:8-10 states.
Actually, these verses further prove my point. For, as my Lord himself SAID:
"The flesh... is of NO use... at all."
So, indeed, when resurrected in the SPIRIT, my Lord again put on FLESH, flesh which was of no use... and was subsequently 'changed'... again... as it was before, in order to 'enter' into the spirit realm... a place that flesh... with its blood... cannot enter.
I can only offer to you Paul's words at 1 Corinthians 15:42-57... and no, I don't 'follow' Paul, but he speaks truth here, which explains that those who belong to the Christ and have died are resurrected in INCORRUPTIBLE... or spirit... bodies. Why would such ones receive something my Lord did not? Does it not occur with him FIRST... and then with us? And such ones are resurrected, as spirits, at the same time that those who have NOT died... are changed... INTO spirits.
Thus, those who take part in the first resurrection, because they are not judged (for those in union with Christ have no judgment), are immediately granted white robes... or spirit bodies... as was my Lord. His 'befouled garment' was removed, and he was given a 'clean turban'. For when HE died, he paid the 'wage' of sin... for his blood... was righteous. We, unfortunately, cannot do the same thing, for our blood, can atone for nothing, including our own sins. His blood, however, ALSO atoned for those who belong to him, so that they CAN be 'raised'... in incorruption... like he was. Their sins are atoned for and they can receive a white... or clean... 'robe'... or body, the SPIRIT one.
Again, I bid you peace.
YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,
SJ
