Resurrection,Did He or didn't He?

by FrankRaven 14 Replies latest jw friends

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  Will Power

  If Christ, while on earth, being a man not God or God-man, was "resurrected" and this is described as a spirit body and He is the same yesterday today and forever he must have always been a spirit body in a fleshy vessel.

  If Christians are taught to believe in their own hope of a resurrection, is this the same word?

  If Christ was not a spirit body in an earthly vessel before his death, as some who define the "soul" But Michael the Archangel in his pre-existance as the WT teaches this makes him changing from Michael the Angel, to human, to spirit, back to Michael the Archangel who the WT also gives the name Abaddon.

  If WT talks about resurrection (at the end) is this definition the same for other "men"?

  Or is it then changed to mean "re-creation"?

  "Verily I say to you today you will be with me in paradise."
  Was this statement describing exactly what Jesus knew would happen? Or was this statement made to trick the guy into thinking that instead of being in paradise with Him today, He was actually telling him that today was the day He was telling him what He was saying as He was saying it?

  Good posts both sides.
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  Will Power

  One more question?

  If someone believes in the bible, and it says we, or Adam, was created in our image, what might this image be? and who was this creator talking to? Did they all look alike? Did they have 10 fingers & toes? or was it something else about our image that was similar?
  Could this be something invisible? When ashamed was this need to be clothed a fleshy body, an earthly vessel, instead of a fig leaf?

  Is this somehow connected with the passages that say they can kill the body but they can't kill your spirit? Was this what Paul meant when discussing the difference between the spirit and the body? Flesh means nothing? Jesus showed us with the resurrection recorded in the bible.

  Sorry, guess that was more than one.
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  gumby

  It is sown (buried) a PHYSICAL body; it is raised up (resurrected)... a SPIRIT body."
  Look up in some good bible commentaries and see is this is THE WAY this scripture reads.
  I have the understanding that the scripture should read..it is raised IN SPIRIT.......not a SPIRIT BODY!

  E-mail me and let me know what you find. Peace to you also although our CUSTOM here usually dosen't end in those words.

  Why do you speak as the hebrews anyway?......and I do not mean this in sarcasm?
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  gumby

  Frank Raven says..,"For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh.

  You never made a point! Who said the witnesess do not believe he CAME in the flesh...........your talking about him leaving!
  Whats your point?
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  AGuest

  Hello, dear Gumby... and may you have peace!

  First, dear one, you must understand what 'spirit' is. It has several forms:

  1. The breath of God - HIS life force, thus the 'spirit' of life
  2. The glorified Christ - A spirit being, and thus, THE Holy Spirit
  3. The blood and regenerative power of God, and therefore, Christ, which is the 'water' of life - 'holy' spirit
  4. Our life force, the means of physical life in us - OUR 'spirit'
  5. A spirit - a being not of physical body, not 'terrestrial', but 'celestial'
  6. A 'good' spirit or 'bad' spirit - a life force from God or allowed by God that motivates us to do good... or bad... to be obedient... or obstinate.

  It is my understanding that the spirit which is our life force is currently it is contained in a clay pot or 'earthen' vessel (treasure hidden in earthen vessels), but such vessels can and will be changed to vessels of spirit, or spirit bodies. That is the 'white robe', the CLEAN 'garment' or 'skin' that covers the TRUE 'naked' man.

  When Adam sinned, he and Eve weren't given animal skins, dear one, but flesh... with its blood. The flesh they had before was spiritual, granted them by JAH when HE put them in the garden: they were taken from the earth OUTSIDE the garden, but flesh with its blood cannot ENTER into the spirit realm. So, while their initial flesh was taken from the earth, to enter they were given 'white robes', bodies of the 'type' that could 'change', or as my Lord said 'go in AND out...' John 10:9

  Zechariah mentioned this when he wrote regarding my Lord, JAHESHUA ("Joshua"):

  "Remove the BEFOULED garment (fleshly physical body, with its blood), and there is a clothing of you with ROBES of state (white robes; spirit body)." Zechariah 3:4

  People get confused when they read this because of my Lord being 'without sin'. But dear one, although no sin was found IN him, his flesh WAS... 'sinFUL'... or full of sin. That is why he carried sickness in such flesh, why it ages... and why it died. Perfect flesh is withOUT sin, and therefore, withOUT death. This is the case because he inherited such sinFUL flesh from his mother, Mary, herself sinful. It was what was IN that flesh, the TRUE man, his SPIRIT, that was 'without sin', for he inherited such spirit... from his FATHER. Thus, he was a half-breed, like Adam:

  Christ = Mary + JAH
  Adam = Earth + JAH

  Even the Master himself, although 'without sin', did not state himself such, asking by means of the Psalmist David for his 'sins, trangressions and errors' to be forgiven, passed over.

  Why would he need to do this if he was without sin? Because, although he WAS without sin IN him, rather than have the attitude of the Pharisee, he chose that of the tax collector, the one 'PROVED more righteous': rather than exalt HIMSELF ("Hey, I've done nothing wrong, Father"), he instead HUMBLED himself, and let GOD... exalt him ("Be gracious to me, O God"). Thereby, PROVING himself righteous by his humility.

  BTW, I 'speak' the way I do, as it is the way my Lord has taught me to speak, when addressing Israel, and those that go with them... as well as ANY who 'hear'... with matters of truth. I hear... and, to the best of my ability... I obey.
  
  I hope this helps.

  Your servant and a slave of Christ,

  SJ