WinstonSmith said - I'm sensing a similar modus operandi to a recently banned user...
I completely agree.
Question?
by Ethos 67 Replies latest jw friends
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creativhoney
one thing I have learned is people believe what they want to. - so you cant change someones beliefs unless they want to change them.
they are very cleverly taught to oppose anything that could take them away - higher ed, critical thinking, apostate lit - obv because anything that makes you think, could wake up the brain and deprogram you...
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sir82
Which topic would you like to see a JW discuss most?
Why do some Jehovah's Witnesses in good standing disobey the clear and direct counsel of the "faithful and discreet slave" by engaging in electronic conversations with persons who are disfellowshipped and apostate? What justification does that JW use to convince himself that "that counsel applies to everyone else but not to me"?
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Londo111
Ethos,
If you are to tackle 607 BC, I suggest the best thing may be to spend many weeks researching all the arguments. I spent several months of careful research on this.
The issues are:
(1) What the Bible says about when Jerusalem was destroyed.
(2) What the historical evidence says about when Jerusalem was destroyed.
(3) Harmonizing our interpretation of the Bible with the historical evidence.
(4) Since the Watchtower Society is the defender of 607 BC, examining whether their argument is honest or dishonest. For instance, checking their quotations of scholars and reference citations in context as to whether there is journalistic integrity in their presentation of these.
It is best to start with the articles in the October/November 2012 Public Watchtower about this subject and go from there.
I highly suspect that even one day, the Society will have to recant this view (even if by pocket veto).
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Ultimate Axiom
Ethos – you have a lot of questions to answer here, so I’ll just repeat the issue that jwfacts has raised, “the ongoing evidence that Holy Spirit is not directing the organisation”. In answering it please explain how an organisation can knowingly misrepresent and lie in attempts to cover over past mistakes? If you need examples use the search facility above, but I would rather not debate examples, just how you can reconcile the lying with "God is Truth".
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tornapart
The one that did it for me... or set the ball rolling, was the 'overlapping generation'... because one wasn't long enough it has died out, they had to invent two generations and try to turn it into one....????
Ethos... why haven't you been back and commented on your other thread about 'Stumbling over errors in the WT' like you said you would.. it would be nice to see you reply to at least a few of the points brought up.
btw, like problemaddict, I'm still a JW too.
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jgnat
I'm not going to invest any more time leading you along, Ethos. You asked for a list of questions on your first thread, and I took the time to summarize them. In other words, this has already been asked and answered. Here's a copy of my summary from your first thread.
SHUNNING
The parable of the Prodigal Son compared to modern judicial meetings (stillajwexelder)
Love is kind, shunning is not (lisaBObeesa)
Why should [Grace’s] family shun her because she doesn't believe that Jesus came invisibly in 1914? (Mouthy/Granny Grace and Oppostate)
BLOOD
Blood is my big issue. I simply cannot see any justification for this to be a matter someone would be disfellowshipped for. I think it has to be a conscience matter by the very definition of what that means. (problemaddict)(TD)(panhandlegirl)(Ethos)
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/242021/1/Transfusion-and-Eating-e28093-no-difference
CHRISTIAN UNITY
I believe true Christian unity is based on love, not total agreement on all issues. (Londo 111)(Marvin Shilmer)(Ethos)
CHANGING DOCTRINE
…the new " Slave " doctrine (DATA-DOG)
flip-flops (New Chapter and 00DAD)
Russell believing that 1874 was the actual year that Jesus came back invisibly and 1914 was originally thought to the end of all human governments? (NotJustYet)
Have you read the book published by the WTS in 1881 called "Tabernacle Shadows". Bro. Russell wrote this book. I would highly recommend reading this. All Bible Students at the time accepted this as "the truth" on the doctrine of the atonement. In a nutshell it taught that Jesus sacrifice at Calvary did not result in a finished work of atonement.(FWFranz)
Past errors/wrong teachings JWs have relinquished and what they signify.(Ethos)
BIBLE INTERPRETATION
If you can prove JW beliefs from the bible… (LouBelle)
the fall [of Babylon]...+70 = 609 BC approx beginning......(pterist)
BEST OF THE BEST
…the WTS being the closest to following God's Holy spirit in our day? (jgnat)
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I would say so far you've only attempted to explain WT inconsistencies, which has resulted on a fair number of spin-off threads on the consequences of these inconsistencies in the lives of regular Witnesses. As far as I can tell, you suggest that nit-picking these all too human bible interpreters depresses and discourages the poor writers in their hard work. And you suggest that science has made many more. You haven't even scratched the surface in responding to the challenges to your reasoning offered on that thread.
You don't need any more suggestions.
I suspect you've never learned the difference between elegant writing and elegant reasoning. Another poster has suggested you pick up a book on critical thinking. I would echo that sentiment.
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Christ Alone
I've noticed that Ethos has not really responded to any questions. When he has responded it has been, "I will be posting a thread about this". Other times it has been a simple response that does not address the issues.
I'm thinking that we may not see much of Ethos...
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Phizzy
I give the guy/girl/committee or whatever we are talking to, just ONE more chance, posting restrictions may be why Ethos hasn't come back on yet.
But, dear C.A, I fear you may well be right, unless "Ethos" pops back yet again in a month or so under another name.
I was really hoping we had, in Ethos, a genuine JW Apologist with the nous to debate, I have never met one yet you see, so its a bit of an ambition of mine.
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notjustyet
I was thinking that the info that he was trying to get IE " What actually wakes up more Jws than anything else?" was just the info that the WTBTS would like to know.
What are we losing all these members to? What are they thinking and how can we do more damage control?
NJY