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by AGuest 61 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  NewChapter

  If he minds, he can yell at me!
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  AGuest

  Now we don't have to address it again, because we both understand.

  Okay (again, peace to you!)

  You cannot offend me by saying that I am not of the household of Israel, so let's set that aside.

  Okay...

  As to the rest---that this household WILL understand etc---that reminds me a great deal of the WT use of the scripture, "the sheep will hear my voice", and how we thought it had the 'ring' of truth. But we were wrong.

  How so? I mean, how did the WTBTS use that verse (unless you mean, to point toward themselves as who the sheep were to listen to, lieu of Christ himsel)... and how were "you" wrong (because it does have the ring of truth to ME, just not as they interpret it)? Otherwise, I can't respond as I'm not sure we have the same understanding on this.

  As to name calling and propaganda and such, I'm not going to comment, because I think you mean those things for someone else. No need for me to get into that.

  I did. I think I stated that, as well.

  I do not 'fear' you. I'm not sure where that comes from. . .

  Okay, we can let that go for now and maybe revisit it another time... although, again, I did state (or thought I did) that I didn't mean you, personally. Mayhaps I missed some quotation marks...

  Also, I have never told ANYONE that they MUST choose my conclusions. Now that is just nonsense. We have discussions. I challenge. I don't tell people what they can and cannot do.

  I think I included the quotation marks as to these comments...

  As to people checking into these visions you have, I know that some don't. I know that because I have had conversations with some. Some felt drawn, and weren't thinking critically. They are now though.

  So, those that don't/didn't weren't thinking critically. Okay, I can accept that. In fact, I vehemently agree with it. Because if it's true, then it stands to reason, though, that those who DID check into them... WERE thinking critically. So, yeah, I'm cool with that.

  Again, peace to you!

  A slave of Christ,

  SA
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  AGuest

  Cofty isn't here yet

  Well, I know he's on the other side of the world, dear Palm (peace to you!), so the time lapse is understandable. I'm gonna turn in soon, though, but I'll leave a light on for him so that we'll know where to find him when he shows.

  Peace!

  A slave of Christ,

  SA
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  Broken Promises

  The attention whore is back.
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  NewChapter

  Okay, we can let that go for now and maybe revisit it another time... although, again, I did state (or thought I did) that I didn't mean you, personally. Mayhaps I missed some quotation marks...

  I don't think that will help. I don't understand how you use quotation marks. Right or wrong, you use them so often and in such unexpected places, I simply fail to register them anymore. If you say 'you' and you don't mean 'me', then I might follow better if you say, some people, or something along those lines. That's more customary, and I am more likely to catch the full meaning. Or not. But I suspect if not, we will continue to have communication break downs.
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  Broken Promises

  NC,

  Don't bother to try to understand A Guest. She's been sprouting this nonsense for more than a decade and anyone who has tried to interpret what the hell she's going on about has ended up in the looney bin. I don 't wish this to happen to you so I'd suggest doing something more productive with your time, like going out to watch the grass grow or something.
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  dontplaceliterature

  My eyes immediately crossed when I clicked on this link.
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  NewChapter

  As to the rest---that this household WILL understand etc---that reminds me a great deal of the WT use of the scripture, "the sheep will hear my voice", and how we thought it had the 'ring' of truth. But we were wrong.

  How so? I mean, how did the WTBTS use that verse (unless you mean, to point toward themselves as who the sheep were to listen to, lieu of Christ himsel)... and how were "you" wrong (because it does have the ring of truth to ME, just not as they interpret it)? Otherwise, I can't respond as I'm not sure we have the same understanding on this.

  I think that you and the WT use it in quite the same way. You said that those of the house of israel will understand--hear--things along those lines. This is what the WT uses when they say that those with receptive hearts will 'hear'. I see this only as an appeal to emotion fueled by confirmation bias. You are ringing a bell, not based on critical thinking, but on an emotion.

  This is how it worked for me. The world was really turning upside down when JW's knocked. I had just seen the wall in Berlin come down almost over night (to my eyes). The Soviet Union was taking a dive. So when they told me that the world would change suddenly, and with little warning, that rang true for me. I thought I had already witnessed major changes very quickly, so I could see it all happening. It 'rang' for me.

  But that was really just reaffirming my confirmation bias, because I already had an opinion of what was going on in the world. I was not thinking critically, because had I been, I would have just looked at recent history and seen that while these highly symbolic things were happening quickly, they were years in coming. We'd gone through a cold war, Reagan came along and said "Tear Down That Wall" (not referring to the Berlin wall, to my understanding) there were endless meetings and a lot of diplomacy. But I was looking at it through a microscope, and the Berlin Wall just miraculously came down over night. So what they were saying was completly conceivable to me.

  Things don't 'ring' for me anymore. I ask too many questions. I break everything down and try to look at the history, the patterns, the many details. I try to consider details that disprove my perception of events. So when I read you saying things like that, I think you are appealing to emotion and suppressing critical thinking. There is so much that we just KNOW is true. It just rings true. We hear. And those things are very often very wrong. But if we aren't open to looking past that sudden pull that we feel, we are vulnerable.

  So yes, I think that people that come to the call of that bell are being vulnerable and not thinking critically. And you are encouraging that by saying that those of the house of israel will hear and accept. It is a red flag to me, and I want it out there to be a red flag for others. Critical thinking is a skill, and only by being exposed to it can we really learn it. So I am doing some exposing. People don't have to come to my conclusions. I only ask them to stop and think. But I want them to do so honestly and criticaly. Honestly, with all your ability, consider that some of these things are not true, no matter what chord they have struck.
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  cofty

  Good morning and good bye - have to go will see you later.

  Just one thing for now...

  I understand. None pertain to me, so you can rest easy as to these. Truly.

  I am increasingly convinced its number 6.
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  AGuest

  The attention whore is back.

  You really shouldn't speak so disparagingly of yourself, BP. I mean, we missed you and all... but the announcement of your return was unnecessary, really. At least, like that. I mean, you could'a just posted, "Hola" and we would have seen you.

  I don't think that will help. I don't understand how you use quotation marks. Right or wrong, you use them so often and in such unexpected places, I simply fail to register them anymore.

  I understand that. I type as I speak/think... and I type VERY fast, so I don't always "catch" things (see, there I used quotations because I'm not literally catching anything, per se, but meaning it to say I don't always realize what I may have typed/missed. And no, I don't always proof... because this is a social discussion board, not an critical writing class...).

  If you say 'you' and you don't mean 'me', then I might follow better if you say, some people, or something along those lines.

  Yes, I understand. When I type "you"... I mean other who think/believe/post in opposition to what I do... which COULD include you personally, but may not... and only you (no quotation marks) know that.

  That's more customary, and I am more likely to catch the full meaning. Or not. But I suspect if not, we will continue to have communication break downs.

  Now, see, here's how I think: if I truly don't understand something you post... but truly WANT to... then all I need do is ask for clarification. Because why would I think you wouldn't give it? If, though, you (or someone else) posts something I don't understand... but I don't really care to, anyway... then I tend to just skip over/ignore it.

  "Custom", however... no, I don't really go that route so much. Unfortunately, I probably don't conform to "group think" well - the "herd" mentality just no longer works for/appeals to me (well, it actually never did, which is why the WTBTS and I were destined to part ways, eventually). I do tend to "dance to a different beat"... but I have GREAT rhythm, so...

  Booo-oooo-oooo-oooo-gie down!

  Peace, dear NC... truly. Perhaps we will one day fully understand one another, perhaps only partially. Perhaps not at all. Do we truly HAVE to... to get along? I personally don't think so...

  A slave of Christ,

  SA