Baptismal Questions CHANGE AGAIN! (page 5)

wha happened?

now I wonder how this is helpful to them in court

I remember when they changed the punishment for taking a blood transfusion from df'ing to da'ing yourself. They told the media that the WTS was not shunning people for this that people were choosing to leave. Up until the new elder's manual came out 2 years ago, it wasn't even in writing. The elders were told verbally, not even to touch the "letter" the CO read from, not allowed a copy for their files. The rank and file still don't know from any open WT publications that members are disassociating themselves when accepting a transfusion, they still think they will be disfellowshipped by the congregation. Dfing is seen as an action by the congregation and da'ing is a personal decision not shunning.

Band on the Run

There is no contract! A contract is a bargain-for exchange that is enforceable by the courts. It may be an agreement. Baptism has no legal standing. You can never go to court and make the WTS liable for broken promises. The WTS cannot go to court to make you do anything. It is a private agreement, whose only legitimacy is the understanding of the parties.

We are far from the traditional notion of baptism, which involved an agreement with God the FAther, Christ, and the Holy Spirit. Not even the RC chuch at its most powerful substituted the pope or cardinals.

I wanted to be baptized when I was twelve. My cousins and I were in earnest competition. We were told that it was a mature decision that had emotional consequences and perhaps we might have maturity to commit to such a promise when we older than thirty. My mom was baptized at 12 or 13.

As much I do not believe, I was always grateful that I was never baptised. The Witnesses teach that once you are baptized, Jehovah treats you much more harshly when you fail.

My baptized cousins soon were knocked-up by brothers. They waited to marry so the baby was mature when it popped out. The math was obvious. No one in their congregations could count. My gm could count all the fallen women in our cong but failed to do so for her gd.

konceptual99

Went to CA today. Question was identifies you as one of JWs in association with Gods spirit directed org. Same ole same ole I think.

Every talk though bashed higher education. Apparently the simple pictures brochure is good for people with dyslexia. We are the best educated people in the world as we have enough to progress the ministry and not enough to become high minded. If you are average at school it is better than excelling as if you excel then Satan wants to use you in his world and you are the victim of your own success.

Apostates are poision as well. Avoid like the plague.

As I said, same ole same ole......

blondie

Thanks konceptual99. I slept through the 1985 change 3 times a year until 2001, 16 years and it wasn't until I came to JWN I realized the change.

konceptual99

Very true Blondie. It's sites like this that point the real new light out. The DA/DF blood thing is one of the things that has got my goat the past couple of years. It's just a disingenuous way of being able to put out "acceptable" PR without changing any of the ground rules for the sheep. As you say, most don't even know and have no official way of knowing.

trillaz

There is no difference in how you will be treated with DA versus DF anymore. So someone taking a blood transfusion and an apostate are essentially one in the same.

lv pp. 207-209

How to Treat a Disfellowshipped Person

"Bible principles on this subject apply equally to those who disassociate themselves from the congregation."

maisha

seems they change what they want to be known by when it suits them,, herin called the ORDER!..

Case No: (HCT-00-CV-CS-0209 OF 2008) Media Neutral Citation: [2009] UGHC 142 Judgment Date: 28 June 2009

The plaintiff is the International Bible Students Association, a religious association incorporated as a company limited by guarantee and registered as a charity in the United Kingdom. It is also registered in Uganda under Part X of the Companies Act. The Plaintiff is a legal entity used by Jehovah’s Witnesses to accomplish its religious activities in Uganda and is the legal structure for Jehovah’s Witnesses in Uganda. The structure of the Plaintiff is premised on spiritual direction being provided by an ecclesiastical Governing Body, the Worldwide Order of Special Full time Servants of Jehovah’s Witnesses, hereinafter referred to as ‘the Order’, an unincorporated international association of religious ministers who have made a vow of obedience and poverty, and a commitment to serve in a special full time capacity. The Order routinely provides the Plaintiff with members of the Order to assist the Plaintiff in accomplishing the religious activities of the Jehovah’s Witnesses in Uganda. These members receive food, shelter, and modest support from the plaintiff to cater for personal necessities in the course of carrying out the plaintiff’s charitable and religious activities in Uganda. The support provided to each of these members is USh. 170,000= per month and USh. 576,000= per year.

damn it makes me laugh,,, and before the internet this stuff was all hidden!,,,

Thank you god for the internet!

JustHuman14

My conclusion, reading this post are the following:

1. Spirit Directed, means that there is a chance of an intepretation mistake, concerning a Biblical text or prophecy. They have always said that we are only DIRECTED with the Holy Spirit, in order to use that as an excuse for their flip flop doctrines and failed prophecies. So if someone comes and points out that they failed, they could easily say, yes because we are only Spirit Directed!!! Now with the new change, spirit anointed, it means that they have received the Holy Spirit, like the Christians in the First Century and immediately they had the gift to perfom miracles, speak foreign tongues, and to prophecy. With this change, WT is saying to their followers, "listen you guys, we are Spirit Anointed, so don't question us, or mess with us". The reason to proceed with this change is to strengthen their status and power over the rank and file.

2. The second change, Association, has to do with legal issues and mainly with their evil practice of disfellowship. So if someone is kicked out, they can easily claim that he doesn't associate with us anymore, saving their asses from the legal issues that they might occur, if they are an Organization, while Association is just a group of people that they are gathering together and share the same ideas.

Indeed WT is becoming more and more a dangerous Cult, and the leaders of the WT, they are only trying to save their asses from responsibility and any legal actions against them.

dropoffyourkeylee

I find this hilarious from maisha's post;

spiritual direction being provided by an ecclesiastical Governing Body, the Worldwide Order of Special Full time Servants of Jehovah’s Witnesses

They are essentially saying they are like the catholic church and their people are like monks in a monastery. I know they are just presenting it this way for legal reasons to get them in the country, but it's ridiculous. I've know a number of Bethelites in my time and they're no monks.

Question: religious ministers who have made a vow of obedience and poverty

Is this for real? Do they really have to make a vow? What if they have money in the bank, for whatever reason, inheritance, etc. do they turn it over or what?

Baptismal Questions CHANGE AGAIN!

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