And noone's interested in answering my shooting scenario question. So sad
Georgia mom shoots home intruder five times
by Bonnie_Clyde 112 Replies latest jw friends
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EntirelyPossible
What if I already know the answer, sooner?
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designs
A lot of fantisizing about killing someone going on here hmmm
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EntirelyPossible
Who is fantasizing about killing anyone?
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PSacramento
A lot of fantisizing about killing someone going on here hmmm
I wouldn't say fantisizing per say but a lot of naive views about taking the life of another human being, yes.
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sammielee24
PS Sac - the biggest threat to any society is inequality of all sorts. Or even perceived inequality. Jones is always talking about tyranny and I should say it's always pretty funny when rabid gun rights groups say 'I'm not worried about the government' ..and then when it is suggested they do not need 50 guns with 6,000 bullets against a burglar, they resort to quoting the 2nd ammendment as a right to bear arms...militia...to resist tyranny. Circular reasoning with no logic at all but to try and create a smoke screen.
When people get up in the morning and make sure their weapon is within reach and they do that on a daily basis, then they wake up every day prepared, willing to kill someone that day. They wake up thinking they might be the victim of violence and that fear puts a weapon in their hand just in case their fear comes true and so at the very center of it all is that people who 'prepare' every day to face their world as a civilian and do so with a gun, are already in a violent frame of mind because the only reason to carry a gun is if you are willing to use it and the only reason there is to have a gun is to kill. (not speaking of a rural rancher or shooting range)
As to Jones - if he spent more time on logic and ways to fight the real tyranny of global finance and corporatism on millions of people around the world, he might be taken more seriously. Countries are disintegrating into societies where income has dropped, taxes have risen and people no longer feel part of any solution but a slave to the debt of their masters - government representation for the corporations and banks. I see that as a much bigger threat because as people get depressed they get prescribed meds to keep them producing, they keep producing but keep losing, they don't sleep, they worry, they lose pensions, homes, hope - when people get hopeless they have little to lose - then they get more scared because if you 'have' you are scared of the 'have not's..and if you are a 'have not' you don't trust the 'have's'. Its happening all over the world and there is a sense of unrest that seems to be getting more and more out of hand - a few guys with guns aren't going to cut it and as more have nots are created, so too might be the threat to those who have...if you don't fix the core problem, all the guns in the world won't help you when 95% of the population is angry. It would be nice to hear more about people power than just a realiance on guns. sammieswife
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RubaDub
She might have got the five intruders as well as killed her own kids - anything is possible.
I guess the kids would just be classified as colateral damage.
Rub a Dub
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Deputy Dog
PS Sac - the biggest threat to any society is inequality of all sorts.
What a load of garbage! The only way we should be equal, is legally under the law.
None of us are equal, nor can we be. We all have our own strengths and weaknesses.
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Deputy Dog
When people get up in the morning and make sure their weapon is within reach and they do that on a daily basis, then they wake up every day prepared, willing to kill someone that day. They wake up thinking they might be the victim of violence and that fear puts a weapon in their hand just in case their fear comes true and so at the very center of it all is that people who 'prepare' every day to face their world as a civilian and do so with a gun, are already in a violent frame of mind because the only reason to carry a gun is if you are willing to use it and the only reason there is to have a gun is to kill. (not speaking of a rural rancher or shooting range)
Wrong! The reason I want to carry is to stop someone from being killed.
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JonathanH
Why do people think that pointing to a single anecdote somehow justifies a terrifyingly bad idea because sometimes it produces good results? Yeah, it's great that lady was able to defend herself. I'm glad no harm came to her or her kids. But it would take me two seconds to find a hundred anecdotes of somebody accidentally shooting a family member, or a kid playing with a gun and shooting a friend, somebody showing they have a gun thinking that will deter a conflict only to in fact escalate the conflict, ect ect ect. Math and statistics trump anecdotes.
Somebody pointed out back much earlier that antigun laws effect places like both Japan and Mexico. Japan has exceedingly little gun violence, mexico has an abundance. The pro-gun side fears we would be more like Mexico. I think they may be right, but the question is why is our society so fucked up that violence is so intrinsically an aspect of our society?
There are 11 times more assault victims in the US than Japan by percentage of population. 198 times more deaths by fire arms in the US than japan. three times more rape victims by percentage of population in the US. Ironically, when polled Americans felt safer walking at night alone than Japanese citizens despite the fact that the japanese were far less likely to come to harm.
http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Japan/United-States/Crime
If it is true that we would be more like Mexico than Japan if we passed stricter anti-gun laws, then that says something about us. Why is our culture so backwards and deficient that that we feel like we need guns to protect ourselves from ourselves? For starters we are a violent culture. Look at this thread. Nobody is lamenting the catastrophic failures of society and the community that lead to a violent thug breaking into a house with a crowbar to do some unspecified crime. The majority of people are congratulating a woman for killing somebody that they feel deserved a good killin'. That is culturally a problem. Our "each person for themselves" mentality doesn't help. Japan is a community oriented culture that expects individuals to put the needs of others above their own. Perhaps instead of just handing guns to everyone and letting nature run it's course, we should actually try to look at why we think handing guns to everybody is a good idea. The fact that we think that is a reasonable course of action in and of itself says something about our culture. Maybe that is why we are Mexico instead of Japan. Economically we are the world's powerhouse, culturally we are still a third world country.
Now you might say that things like trying to encourage a sense of community, community responsibility, trying to make it so we don't view "appropriate" violence as a virtue but rather as a failure of the community to prevent violence, you might say those are all pie in the sky "liberal" dreams. But the machismo power fantasy of an individual successfully preventing a school shooting by carrying a concealed weapon and using it in a responsible and skillful way to wound or if necessary kill an evil individual is also a fantasy. And honestly, it is a far less healthy fantasy for a culture to propogate. And statistically it is horribly unrealistic. That simply isn't what is happening out there.
When the anecdotes are viewed against the statistics, the actual motto of the Pro-Gun Lobby is "If we shoot enough people, some of them are bound to have deserved it." Why don't we just try to find a way to shoot less people? It has worked for Japan.