Meridian and Energy Therapies

by NoOnesMan2002 27 Replies latest watchtower medical

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  Quotes

  Intro:
  - My apologies re: the defensive comment, it was late and I was tired. You are correct, there is not need for that sort of thing.

  - I'm not sure why you say I've quoted Quackwatch "several times", I vaguely recall using it one other time on this board. To me, several is more than two. If my recollection is wrong, please show me the "several times".

  - I agree with you completley, we should have an open mind and test new ideas! I COULDN'T AGREE MORE! That is what medicine, and science in general, is all about. It is not, and should not be, dogmatic. However, once something has been throughly tested and found to be ineffective and/or dangerous (I am talking in general here, not specifically about Meridian therapy or anything else) then it makes no sense to continue to say "it could work." You are correct, it does make for interesting drama. In reminding us that there is a difference between inquiry & skepticism vs. cynicism, I thank you.

  Mulan:
  - thanks for the correction, yes, the human body does work using millions of tiny electro-chemical impulses.

  - again, if Magnet Therapy works for you, GREAT! In general studies however, it has been shown to be ineffective -- at least no more effective than a placebo, and if given the choice between no cure and an effective placebo, yes, I'll also take the relief.

  - I'm truly happy for your arthritic friend and glad she has found relief.

  - We agree that St. John's Wort has been proven to effective. Yes, sometimes the wheels of Medical Science turn slowly, and that bothers me too... but again we agree it has been shown to be effective and hence has become part of "Medicine".

  - Yes, some drugs are based on herbs. As you said, they are "extracted" which involves careful chemical control and refinement. The Ephedra in Ma Huang again has been shown to be effective. I agree completely. I never said that all herbals are ineffective, and I'm sorry if that is what you understood.

  I think we are arguing over nothing. I stand by my original post, the essence of which was:

  - I am happy that NoOnesMan2002 is "feeling relief" wherever that relief comes from (we agree on that)

  - Meridian Therapy has not been validated by Medical Science (we agree on that)

  - NoOnesMan2002 should continue to see a Physician, and what I meant by that was to keep in mind what the "C" stands for in "CAM" -- complementary.

  Finally, I think one of the earlier posts mentioned something about "tapping while thinking affirmations." I would like to focus on the affirmations part of this -- this could in itself explain the beneficial effect you have experienced. In his 1980 book Feeling Good -- The New Mood Therapy (The Clinically Proven Drug-free Treatment for Depression) David D. Burns, M.D. deals with using, among other things, affirmations and positive self image to fight depression. The techniques outlined in this book have been proven to be effective, and this has become widely accepted in the Medical community. Let's see: safe, effective, free... that sounds nice... and clinically proven. Hhhmmm... affirmations.... maybe (this part of) Meridian Therapy is valid after all.

  See? I'm not such a bad guy! I found common ground we can all agree on. BTW I highly recommend this book!

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  For interesting Watchtower Society literature quotes, complete with references but without any editorial, check out:
  http://Quotes.JehovahsWitnesses.com
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  Mulan

  Cool!!

  Now, about the pharmaceuticals.......I am acquainted with 2 PhD's who have worked in R & D for pharmaceutical companies. They told me that the Pharm. companies are frantically trying to find a way to be able to use the herbs, in their drugs, but can't get the rights to them, because they occur naturally in our environment. They try to alter them, so they can classify them as a drug, and over the years have done so. Carefully done? Probably, but not in as ideal a motive as you might think. It's all about money. If it weren't for money, why would you have to pay hundreds of dollars for a prescription, and only a few dollars for an herbal product, that probably does the same thing? If I go to Canada, the same prescriptions are a fraction of what we have to pay in the U.S. The natural one might take longer, but they will eventually do the job, without side effects or addictions. I am NOT talking about antibiotics, although there are some natural things that have that effect too, but not fast enough for me, even. If you don't have insurance, you had better have a big bank account. I took my father to a doctor recently, and he filled a prescription for blood pressure meds, that was $348..........for ONE MONTH!!! He has medicare.........didn't cover it.

  Marilyn (aka Mulan)
  "No one can take advantage of you, without your permission." Ann Landers
  
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  Quotes

  What? Money? Pharmaceuticals are just in it for the money????

  Again, something we can agree on.

  I have heard, it has been said that if Aspirin/Willow Bark were discoverd today, it would never get past the regulations and testing to get to market. That is a huge problem, and as I said in my post, the wheels of medical science turn slowly... the money issue just aggravates the problem.

  Having said that, I would still prefer to take one Aspirin rather than suck on Willow Bark all day long to get the same effect. They've both been shown effective, they both have the same active ingredient, but one is more convenient than the other.

  ===========================
  For interesting Watchtower Society literature quotes, complete with references but without any editorial, check out:
  http://Quotes.JehovahsWitnesses.com
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  Introspection

  Quotes:
  

  - I'm not sure why you say I've quoted Quackwatch "several times", I vaguely recall using it one other time on this board. To me, several is more than two. If my recollection is wrong, please show me the "several times".

  LOL, would you like me to prove that this was statistically significant too? I admit my recall on this is vague too, and if we're talking about the number of threads it involved it is definitely only two, the other being that homeopathy thread. I apologize too if I read more into your posts than what you had intended, but I am not looking to "prove" that you meant anything - I'll believe you.

  The truth is, regardless of subject matter a lot of the posts on this board just looks like the same stuff in different packaging to me. It's almost as if there's this general tendancy toward aversion because there was this bad experience with the WTS, and then you have the common tendancy to cling, and a lot of times you just have people who cling to aversion. It's not unlike Mr. Horse from Ren & Stimpy saying "No sir, I didn't like it!" It's like food, nobody likes just one type of food, and it all depends on whether you're talking about a meal, dessert or whatever. Yet the common response is the simplistic like it/don't like it judgement. I'm sure you'd agree that such a reactive response based on some personal experience, whether good or bad, is fairly meaningless. Now granted this is very general and perhaps vague to many, but regardless of what we're talking about if you have this attitude toward things of course you're going to have problems! It could be physical or mental health, or to look at it from another perspective just how you live life, or don't. And we wonder why ex-JWs have a hard time?
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  Mulan

  I agree with you on White Willow. It will work on minor pain, and in the wilderness, I might search for some, but if there is aspirin or Ibuprofen, I will choose them first!!!

  Marilyn (aka Mulan)
  "No one can take advantage of you, without your permission." Ann Landers
  
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  Quotes

  Just to clarify. I've checked my post on Homeopathy:

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=23930&site=3

  I did not refer to Quackwatch in that post.

  No, I don't ask for statistical analysis of my posting record (especially in this case -- quoting Quackwatch -- because you can't perform an actuarial analysis on a sample of one).

  ===========================
  For interesting Watchtower Society literature quotes, complete with references but without any editorial, check out:
  http://Quotes.JehovahsWitnesses.com
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  Introspection

  Quotes, not that it really matters (and apparently I need to point out that I made the statistical analysis comment jokingly) but you made reference to Homeowatch, "A Quackwatch subsidiary operated by Stephen Barrett, M.D." I figured it was the same difference. You're right about "several" being more than two of course, but the point is does such nit picking really matter? As I said, I'll take your word that it was not your intention to poo poo all things "alternative", whatever that is.
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  NoOnesMan2002

  I apologize for not reading everyone's recent comments in detail, although I did scan them. I am at this moment reading "Welcome to EFT," an ebook by Christine Sutherland, an Australian psychotherapist with 26 years' experience. I would like to share a few "gems" - in my opinion and perception, anyway - from Dr. Sutherland's book. You may download the ebook from her Website http://www.lifeworks-group.com.au ,and read it in its entirety, if you wish. Here's a direct link to the ebook: http://www.lifeworks-group.com.au/profile/eft_manual.pdf

  "My first attempt to actually use EFT was during a shocking migraine headache. Despite total disbelief that anything could help me (it had struck suddenly and I had been in too much pain and distress to do more than crawl on my hands and knees into bed - couldn't even get to a painkiller), EFT eliminated not only the pain, but aslo the nausea, dizziness,and vision effects in less than 15 seconds all up. I had never experienced anything like that before in my entire life and was sold then and there on EFT." (Anecdotal evidence.)

  "There is now a wealth of medical and scientific evidence, including validated research trials, books, papers, theses, which testify to the value of this work. Every day, ordinary therapists like me are getting extraordinary, permanent results for people whom modern allopathic medicine [was] unable to help. Any doctor who ridicules or condemns clients for attending to complementary therapies is in my opinion being not only deliberately ignorant, but is unprofessional in the extreme."

  It seems to me that the pointed statements in the latter paragraph raise the question: Who is being "deliberately ignorant," or engaging in deliberate, harmful falsification - Dr. Sutherland, or quackwatch.com?

  Dr. Sutherland's ebook thoroughly "gives away the store," teaching the reader explicitly how to use EFT. It does not present EFT as a panacea, noting that the success rates reported by various practitioners are between 50% and 99%. "Your mileage may vary."

  In my opinion, it is an example of 'deliberate ignorance,' when reading a post such the one of mine that initiated all of this discussion - which includes a link to a copious wealth of information - to summarily dismiss all of that without thorough consideration, by appeal to the self-appointed authority of a possibly biased and agenda-based Website such as quackwatch.com.

  Of course, we are all thinking people here, and we can, if we choose, look up the information, decide for ourselves if it sounds credible and is worth our time to try to put to use. Then we can try these therapies on ourselves, basically AT NO COST, and see if they help us with our problems - regardless of what quackwatch.com and their ilk have to say about them.

  Love and regards,
  George