Need Help - Parent in ICU

by AudeSapere 39 Replies latest watchtower medical

• 

  skeeter1

  Have the surgeon go to www.ajwrb.org. Show the surgeon the allowed fractions. Also, tell the surgeon that "current therapy" is allowed. It's, basically, cell tagging. One's blood is taken out of hte body, mixed with chemicals in a separate location/building/room, and then later retransfused into the body hours later. Jehovah blesses this, but doesn't bless whole blood. Jehovah blesses hemoglobin, which is 99.9% of the red blood cell, but doesn't allow packed, washed fred blood cells.

  The words "current therapy" and "fractions" are both made up by the Society. Show this to the surgeon so he might be able to talk this out with the parent.
• 

  AudeSapere

  Thank you for your thoughtful responses. For a variety of reasons I don't want to address each response separately - out of respect for my parent.

  20 years since DF'g with an aging guilt-laden, depressed person in pain and just out of surgery is complicated. Parent is mostly JW apologist but I softening the stance thru gentle and logical discussion.

  Cofty's comments, I will share this with parent:

  Is it worth trying to reason with parent that the prohibition on blood is based on a simple misunderstanding?, Did that w/ good success.

  It was fine to eat unbled meat as long as the animal had not been killed - if it was found "already dead". Lev 11:38,39 Good to note.

  Blood only had significance if a life had been taken therefore it does not apply to transusions. Excellent point. Must remember this.

  I wish you well. Thank you
• 

  AudeSapere

  Did not mean to just single out just Cofty, but those quickly caught my eye.

  Jg and Rebel - Also very help, thank you. I did look at ajwrb yesterday but too much info to wade thru with limited internet access at hosp.

  The California 'Springs Fire' started in my neighborhood so I am dealing with that, respiratory issues at home and parent in hospital and no internet so really REALLY appreciate the links and succinct 'conceptual' talking/thinking points to share with parent.

  In pm, one poster gave me this link from 2005: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/journal-church-state-wt-no-blood-expose

  The above link discusses 'Jehovahs Witnesses Blood Transfusions and the Tort of Misreprehension'.

  Does anyone have the full article of a link to it?

  @Skeeter (and others suggesting that the surgeon do some reading) - not going to happen. I am dealing with dismissive, arrogant, and now defensive Cardio-Thorasic surgeon. Cannot say more, but I have delicate balance and trying to logically provide balanced and updated info on current WT allowance of fractions to parent so that I confident that parent is making an informed consent not based on emotion, guilt, fear or out-dated cult directives and sanctions. [surgeon is trying to bully into submission and that bullying triggers the martyr response. Surgeon flat out refuses to discuss, let alone research.]

  Although, I might be able to leave him (or the other doctor) a copy of the Kerry Lauderbock article from 2005, if someone can email it to me or provide link.

  Thanks again for all the help.

  -Aude.
• 

  AudeSapere

  @Finkelstein - Got it. And I agree with you. Have already had open discussions with this parent. However, now the rubber meets the road and our discussions are not complete but parent needs to make decision and I no have time or access to sort thru so much data for the specifics. If you can help with links to specific threads that you think made 'ah ha!' points, please share them.

  @Shirley - there are multiple siblings, each with own view including active, devote JW. Fortunately, we all agree that each must make their own decisions and then deal with their own consequences - whatever that may be.

  @lost - OMFG. Glad your story had a happier ending rather than the tragedy that could have been.

  @Happy@last, crazyguy and justia - Thank you. Some good points (apple pie, mercy no sacrifice, flip-flops). I will reference.

  Ever grateful for the support and understanding here.

  -Aude.
• 

  *lost*

  AS - I understand even though DF, still holding to the religion in the heart. that bond to God, is not, and never will be broken to the individual. Even if they not attending. I wasn't Df, just inactive ( thank God, now I have learned so much from everyone here. I've only been awake now for a few months)

  Even when I was inactive, not studying and going under the knife, i stood by the no blood. people don't get it. It's not about logic. It is one's personal relationship with God that is on the line. the cord cannot be severed.

  My new hubby to be has told me straight out ( even though he is/was supportive of my beliefs, even came to some meetings with me, never says bad word about the religion )

  The blood thing, no way would he back me up on it. He would make me have it if it meant saving my life. Now I don't have to worry, lol, i know TTATT.

  Your parent is in an awful predicament. and stress is the worst thing for depression. When your at that low point, when dying is easier, there is no strength to fight to live. If you put to much pressure on, parent may shut down. be careful.

  I do hope it goes ok for you.
• 

  AudeSapere

  Lost wrote: Your parent is in an awful predicament. and stress is the worst thing for depression. When your at that low point, when dying is easier, there is no strength to fight to live. If you put to much pressure on, parent may shut down. be careful.

  Yes. Your assessment is exactly right. It is why I am angry with surgeon for creating drama when a calm discussion is yeilding better results.

  Thank you again.

  -Aude.
• 

  jgnat

  Sorry to hear about the ignorant surgeon. Great surgeons have great and sensitive hand-eye coordination. People skills are secondary. Maybe work through the other doctor.
• 

  cofty

  Aude - there is a fuller explanation of my point here, 12 posts down....

  I hope it helps then to have a more reasonable approach to the issue.
• 

  AudeSapere

  jg - Point well-taken.

  Cofty - wow. Nice.

  Does anyone remember and have link to the thread that spoke to the 'symbol' being less critical than the real thing? I remember an anology about a married couple with rings on the nightstand. Fire breaks out in the house and the husband rushes to save the rings - symbol of their life, love and commitment - but leaves the wife to die in the fire. He placed greater value on the symbol than the living, breathing wife lying next to him.

  Sound familiar to anyone? Help me fine-tune the metaphore?? I thought it was brilliant when I first heard it and it helped me change my heart on the blood issue - LONG after I walked way from the KH.

  -Aude.

  PS: Huge thank you to the poster who phoned me this afternoon. I will share bit of our conversation with parent tonight.
• 

  Scully

  I think the analogy goes something like this:

  Husband and wife are walking together when approached by an armed robber. The gunman demands all their valuables and says to the husband that he will shoot the wife if they don't comply. All they have is a small amount of cash and their wedding rings. They turn over their cash, but the husband hesitates when it comes to their rings - they are a symbol of their marriage, something they value dearly.

  The story doesn't continue, except to ask the rhetorical question: With his wife's life on the line, why would he hesitate and place more value on a mere symbol of their marriage rather than on his wife, the other party in the marriage? The symbol in the form of wedding rings can be replaced, but the life of the person to whom he is married cannot be replaced.

  PS: Check your PMs