Are we religiously intolerant?

by Sirona 18 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  Silverleaf

  Hi Sirona,

  I'm Pagan also and unfortunately there's a lot of misunderstadning about the Pagan belief systems, most of it caused by fundies putting their spin on what they THINK we believe while sugarcoating what they believe. While this site often does have personal attacks, for the most part, the stories that are told here do something that I think is very important, they help to expose the injustice that has gone on for too long. One thing I believe as a Pagan is all people are responsible for their own actions and if someone is doing something in the name of their God, it better be able to stand the light of day. This seems to be not so true for the JW leadership.

  What's interesting to me is, I would not have believed half the stuff I read here if I hadn't seen it myself when a JW friend tried to actively recruit me. He couldn't understand why the wonderful organization seemed so strange to me, why I found the people I met to be rude, arrogant and suspicious, and I spent years thinking there was something wrong with me because of it.

  It's hard not to be intolerant sometimes, but if their actions were as pure as they claim, no one would have any reason to be intolerant.

  Silverleaf
  JMHO
• 

  Yerusalyim

  No, Tolerance does not include acceptance. Intolerance would be if we tried to force our beliefs on a JW or if we refused to hire a JW or to rent to a JW, that would be intolerance. NO, I simply reject their teaching as false (which is NOT intolerant but rather exercising my right to free thinking). What I most oppose about JW's is the use of coercion to keep memebers attached.

  YERUSALYIM
  "Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
  [Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
• 

  Sirona

  Path: yes, I agree. We should respect their decision and not attempt to stop them from attending or anything like that.

  Silverleaf: I agree that most intolerance is caused by ignorance. Many people don't understand what paganism is and thats why there are so many problems! Unfortunately, even though Ex-Jws understand the JW faith, they are often intolerant because they don't agree with it. Simply not agreeing with something is not an excuse to give them grief.

  Yeru, I agree with you that intolerance would be if we tried to force our belief on them or wouldn't hire them cause they were JW. Many ex-jw's do just that. Rejecting the teaching as false is OK if you dont let it affect how you treat the person (e.g. should always be with respect)

  Sirona

  ** http://www.religioustolerance.org **
• 

  Yerusalyim

  Intolerance of Terrorists is not caused by ignorance, but rather experience. There are certain peoples and groups that should not be tolerated. Among them I would place terrorists, dreg dealers, and smurfs.

  YERUSALYIM
  "Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
  [Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
• 

  rebelledat12

  An adult has every right to practice their own religion. The problem with JWs is that they demand their children believe as they believe. When the child makes it clear that they don't believe, the parents and congregation force the child to attend meetings, listen to doctrine, etc. The elders meet with the child and say hurtful and demeaning things designed to guilt trip the child into retracting statements of non-belief. They try scare tactics, they say that you aren't tough enough, that you just want to be a member of the world because it's easier - among other degrading comments too numerous to mention. And if all that doesn't work, they shun you self rightously. (I know, it happened to me.)
  If this was the Catholic religion doing the above-mentioned things, the witnesses would applaud the child for standing firm in their beliefs.
  Doesn't the freedom of religion extend to everyone regardless of age or circumstance?
  This is just one example of a double standard that exists in the organization.
  I am not intolerant of adults chosing to practice their own religion. I am bothered by and tend to "hate" an ORGANIZATION that approves of gestapo tacts to scare children into becoming "believers".
• 

  Abaddon

  Obviously individuals are individuals and religions are another.

  One should not automatically hold one responsible for the actions of the other.

  For example, what's the POINT being mad with an individual cultist? They're in a CULT. They are not responsible for their actions. High Control Group. You know. You've been there.

  If someone is being an asshole as an individual ANYWAY, and would still be an asshole (or whatever) if they were worshipers of the great Oz, then it's quite reasonable to get pissed off with the individual.

  But, if they are just being a good little cultist reacting to the buttons we push, just because it's not that particular individual's fault, doesn't mean we can take the cultist shit they dish out.

  We shouldn't react at times. And sometimes we do, even when we should just, er, turn the other cheek or something.

  And we are over sensitive to religious intolerance. We are intolerant of it. Which is horrible, doing what we hate.
• 

  Simon

  I think it's a good point Sirona - the WTS did often make the point that we should hate the sin, not the sinner.

  It's hard not to feel resentment against individuals who have wronged us or those in positions that represent the society but ultimately it's what they do and the fact that they deny people the freedom to choose that most people have an issue with (I think)
• 

  BeautifulGarbage

  Hi Sirona,

  I think you make a good point, however, I keep getting hung up on the word respect.

  I DO NOT, WILL NOT, EVER respect the beliefs of the WTS and those that choose to support their doctines. Why would I respect a belief system that destroyed my family? That would deny life-saving blood transfusions for children?

  Now, tolerance is a different matter. If JW doctrine falls within the perimeters of what is legal, I suppose I really don't have a choice. Yet, if a doctrine doesn't, why should I have to tolerate that?If it is illegal, it SHOULD NOT be tolerated.

  Now, does that mean I get into debates with every JW I encounter? No.
  I don't bring the subject up, unless they do first. Then, they are fair game. I certainly don't attack, but make my opinions on the subject of the WTS abundantly clear.

  Could my opinions be interpeted as intolerant?

  You betcha, baby!

  Andee
• 

  Sirona

  Some great points made here. I especially agree with the point regarding children...it is such cruelty to put a young person in that position and to "scare" them into being a JW.

  Abaddon said:
  

  Obviously individuals are individuals and religions are another.

  One should not automatically hold one responsible for the actions of the other.

  This is certainly true. I think thats the mistake that some people make - they hate ALL individual JWs instead of hating the religion or organisation behind it.

  Simon - yes its the control aspect. I suppose we can never know where to draw the line with religion because so many religions have a degree of control attached to them. Some, like JWs, are worse of course!

  Garbage: by "respect" I meant respect their RIGHT to have any beliefs they want as an individual, not respect their actual beliefs. I don't respect the belief that you can't have blood, but I respect someones right to choose if they have blood or not.

  Sirona

  ** http://www.religioustolerance.org **