I was actually thinking about this just the other day. Although I'm not a pagan, I can see how it is the logical choice for many. After all, what besides being a JW have you been immersed in, for that matter something that's always been there? Nature. I think I see nature a bit differently than most pagans, but you certainly can't ignore nature in any case. For that matter, some atheists who pursue a study in science are also very much interested in nature, so I guess that is the common denominator.
From JW to Pagan
by Sirona 42 Replies latest jw friends
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COMF
I took a look at Wicca on my way from JW to agnostic. I spent a long Saturday afternoon examining book after book on it at a local bookstore that had a huge bookshelf filled with literature on it.
I came away with the knowledge that it, like Christian religions, is just another powerless superstition sidetracking humans from reality.
COMF
Edited to change "useless superstition" to "powerless superstition", because obviously GentlyFeral has a use for it.
Then to the lip of this poor earthen urn
I lean'd, the secret of my life to learn:
And lip to lip it murmur'd--"While you live,
Drink!--for, once dead, you never shall return." -
Satanus
I like the paganism that falls into cirona's definition. It's a bit like taoism. But i resist taking on any labels. Mine is defintely a one man religion. No, it's more like 'a way', which is what tao means, also what the religion jesus started was called, at first.
SS
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Satanus
spidermonkey
BTW, welcome!
SS
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Sirona
Spidermonkey : Welcome! Like you, I don't think that my move to paganism was a reaction against the JWs. I still wonder whether some may see paganism as their way out of the WT bonds. Generally, though, I think that exJWs consider their faith perhaps more than some others who were never part of a controlling religion.
Gently Feral
For me, paganism has been more like nutritional therapy. Spending far too much time as a jaydub starved me of all the good things paganism supplies: beauty, art, a huge field for the imagination, freedom, pleasure, and respect for other people and their beliefs.
I agree with that completely.Intro: you seem to have it
COMF
like Christian religions, is just another powerless superstition sidetracking humans from reality
What is reality? Some would say that our own reality is all we know, and that there is no ONE reality. Anyway, assuming that there is a "reality" there is a chance that paganism does sidetrack us from it to some degree. Is that bad? Also, I don't think that ANY faith is powerless. Superstition doesn't enter into my faith either.SS: isn't it liberating to finally know that we can follow our own path spiritually, without guilt?
Sirona
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COMF
Hi, Sirona,
What is reality?
The way things really are.
Some would say that our own reality is all we know, and that there is no ONE reality.
Yes, I know that they would say that.
Anyway, assuming that there is a "reality" there is a chance that paganism does sidetrack us from it to some degree. Is that bad?
Depends on what you want, Sirona. For folks who want to know what's really going on, who don't want to be deceiving themselves about the practical usefulness and purpose of certain ritualistic actions or the state of the unseen, yes, it's bad.
Also, I don't think that ANY faith is powerless. Superstition doesn't enter into my faith either.
Okay.
Isn't it liberating to finally know that we can follow our own path spiritually, without guilt?
Yes, it is. Have fun with it, with my blessing.
COMF
Perplext no more with Human or Divine,
To-morrow's tangle to the winds resign,
And lose your fingers in the tresses of
The cypress-slender Minister of Wine. -
Sirona
Hi Comf,
So you think reality is
The way things really are.
The way things are to WHOM? We all experience things differently and see life differently. Reality is different from person to person. So I expect you might mean "the way things are" for you?For folks who want to know what's really going on, who don't want to be deceiving themselves about the practical usefulness and purpose of certain ritualistic actions or the state of the unseen, yes, it's bad.
You seem to be assuming an awful lot here, Comf.1. That "whats really going on" can be defined, or that "whats really going on" is different from what pagans do. I know of many pagans who appreciate that ritual is mostly to do with our own psyche and it affects US more than anything else. For instance, if we ritually remember our dead loved ones, we are helping ourselves to cope with their loss. In that sense, a pagan knows "whats really going on" and doesn't expect some miraculous thunderbolt during the ceremony.
2. You assume that there is deception involved in assessing the practical usefulness or purpose of ritual. Perhaps to some degree we all practice self deception. We tell ourselves that we act a certain way for a certain reason, just to make ourselves feel better, or just to ignore something difficult to cope with. That is human nature. With regard to the usefulness of ritual - well then that depends on the individual. Personally, I find it very useful. The purpose of it is something that I decide before I start. So I can't see where the deception is. However, if you had a charlatan telling people that a ritual will provide them with XYZ then that would be deception, but it would not be a reflection of paganism, rather, the individual.
3. The state of the unseen. What do you mean by that exactly?
Sirona
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Sunchild
Sirona,
The way things are to WHOM? We all experience things differently and see life differently. Reality is different from person to person. So I expect you might mean "the way things are" for you?
Just had to put in that you are SO damn cool. You've pretty much said everything I would've said myself, and the more I see of "my people" , the more convinced I am that Pagans are born, not made. It's not about looking for a religion: it's finding a name for what you believe.
Just out of curiosity, do you end up making accidental connections with other Pagans semi-frequently, too, in places where you're not looking for them or expecting to find them? Maybe it's just my experience, but it seems like we tend to be drawn to each other.
*Rochelle.
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"I can teach you how to bottle fame, brew glory, even stopper death -- if you aren't as big a bunch of dunderheads as I usually have to teach."
-- Professor Severus Snape, Harry Potter and the Sorceror's Stone. -
Xander
do you end up making accidental connections with other Pagans semi-frequently, too, in places where you're not looking for them or expecting to find them?
Just out of curiosity, how do you know you've run into a pagan? I mean, we don't exactly LOOK any different than, say, a Christian. Obviously, we don't were crosses, but most Christians don't, either.
Unless you are in the habit of bringing up religion with every new person you meet ...the only people you'd really talk about religion with are people you are close too because they have the same hobbies, or same interests, etc.
Or, am I completely off my rocker?
Xander F
(Unseen Apostate Directorate of North America - Ohio order)A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
--George Santayana -
COMF
So you think reality is "The way things really are." The way things are to WHOM?
The way things are. Period. The actual state of things, outside of all perceptive filters.
We all experience things differently and see life differently.
True.
Reality is different from person to person.
You are confusing reality with perception. Perception is different from person to person. The reality is the same for everything. It's what is, not what is perceived. It's what is now and will continue to be after you and your perception are dead. It's what would continue to be if all perception ceased.
So I expect you might mean "the way things are" for you?
Nope.
I know of many pagans who appreciate that ritual is mostly to do with our own psyche and it affects US more than anything else. For instance, if we ritually remember our dead loved ones, we are helping ourselves to cope with their loss. In that sense, a pagan knows "whats really going on" and doesn't expect some miraculous thunderbolt during the ceremony.
Growing His Love Spell
It's time for you to take that leap of faith and call upon a powerful psychic to help get your man.Retrieve a Lover
If you long for the return of a lost lover...there is something you can do about it!Andreika the Witch
Magical powers beyond your imagination--see what Andreika's Wicca Spells can do for you!OBEAH
Obeah is an unstoppable force--it should be used only as a last resort!The Reconciliation Spell
Establish an unbreakable bond between the two of you!Money Spell
Money Problems? The solution may be easier than you think.The Love Spell
Summon the spirits to improve a current relationship or start a new one.The Breakup Spell
Is your heart breaking because your true love is with someone else?Gris-Gris Voodoo Spell
A Gris-Gris Voodoo Spell may gain momentum until it becomes an unstoppable force!- http://www.calastrology.com/spells.html
However, if you had a charlatan telling people that a ritual will provide them with XYZ then that would be deception, but it would not be a reflection of paganism, rather, the individual.
Right. Spells have nothing to do with wicca. Got it.
The state of the unseen. What do you mean by that exactly?
Belief in spirit creatures. Belief in unseen forces that you can control by standing a certain way at a certain time and chanting certain words while holding certain objects. Why not pray? It's less trouble and gets the same result.
COMF
Perplext no more with Human or Divine,
To-morrow's tangle to the winds resign,
And lose your fingers in the tresses of
The cypress-slender Minister of Wine.