DATING THE BOOK OF REVELATION - new article (page 4)

Pterist

Eden, FYI if interested ....Lecture 37 ...The fall of Jerusalem .....

Shalom

Eusebius also quotes from Ireneaus. Ireneaus, in turn, claims that he learned it through Polycarp (one generation before), who claims to have seen it (Ireneaus doesn't specify what Polycarp saw) from the time he was with the apostle John. It ends up being hearsay.

Eden

jgnat

If the car is on blocks I don't need to take it on a test drive. I know it's not going anywhere.

You haven't used any semi-contemporary sources to anchor your argument. My whip through the googlesphere came up with other sources than the ones you mentioned.

EdenOne

I used cross references with other NT documents. Doesn't textual evidence mean anything to you?

You need another external evidence as an anchor?

Consider the congregations in Asia Minor that Paul started. They were originally 9. Ephesus, Pergamon, Philadelphia, Sardis, Thyatira, Smyrna, Colosse, Hierapolis, and Laodicea. It would be natural that Jesus would address messages to all these congregations. But Colosse and Hierapolis are missing. Why?

Roman historian Tacitus records a devastating earthquake that destroyed the three neighbouring cities of Colosse, Hierapolis and Laodicea, as having taken place on the 7th year of emperor Nero. This amounts to 61 CE. Of the three cities, only Laodicea was soon rebuilt, again according to Tacitus, while the others remained uninhabited. On the other hand, the prophetic message delivered by Jesus to the congregation of Philadelphia, it warns about the hour of tribulation that was "about to come to the world", a reference to persecution. Nero unleashed the persecution against the Christians in AD 64. So, the part of Revelation that deals with the seven messages to the seven congregations (The last part to be received) can indeed be anchored between the dates 61 and 64 AD, more likely 62/63 AD.

Eden

EdenOne

Also (quote from another website):

The “Syriac version” of the New Testament, which dates back to the second century A.D., states that Revelation was written during the reign of Nero making a date of 64-68 A.D.
The “Muratorian Fragment,” dating back to 170-190 A.D., states that this work of John was written during the reign of Nero.
The “Monarchian Prologues,” that dates back to 250-350 A.D., claims that Paul also wrote to these seven churches (possibly Romans which was a circular letter; It went out to many addressees) following John’s Book, thus, placing the book [Revelation] even before some of the other Pauline epistles.

Eden

Band on the Run

I am so so sick with allergies. Let me put it this way. I expect far better from you. Also, I am tired of dumbing down here. There is no need for it. Many others post things that are intriguiing and exercise my mind. In fact, sometimes I can't keep up. This is drivel. Perhaps I would be more polite with someone doing their best. When it comes to math and science, I simply freeze. Your posts are usually good. I recall your user name b/c they can be so good.

This is nonsense. No, I will not bother my eyes. Now there is a record of response to your musings, which are not factual. My duty is done.

EdenOne

BOTR,

Fair enough, I can see your point. I can't say I apologize for not living up to the standard that you claim you usually view me upon, but it is what it is this time. I am starting to discern an issue here with the dates that i haven't realized before, but I got a theory that I need to put it to test before I even discuss it.

All in all, i wish you get better from the allergies. I know that I have frequent respiratory issues because of them.

Eden

TheOldHippie

" John would have been released from Patmos in 68 AD (or shortly thereafter) and the time when he received this revelation and wrote it down would have been prior to 70 AD. John himself mentions in the book that he was at Patmos, when he received this revelation. Given the commentary of Paul about a distinguished disciple receiving visions of heavens and secret revelations in the year 41 CE, and assuming that disciple was John, then the visions of John began even before he was exiled to Patmos"

The two parts I have underlined, says it all to me. If one assumes things and states things would have happened - then all is possible ,,,,,,,,

EdenOne

TOH

The first case is a logical deduction; The second is an assumption.

Eden

jgnat

No, it is not enough to confirm one text against another. Just because there is more than one legend of Thor does not mean that one text confirms the other. To anchor in time, there has to be some mention of a historical event that can be confirmed by secondary sources.

Darnit, you made me look under the hood. Only three of the seven cities in Revelation are mentioned elsewhere in the bible.

DATING THE BOOK OF REVELATION - new article

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