4 sincere questions for those that believe there is a God

by S EIGHT 89 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Lied2NoMore
    Lied2NoMore

    I'm starting to think...it makes sense god won't intervene or display himself or appoint someone to speak for him..after all...look at all the harm that has been done and the arrogance displayed by those who claim to represent god. (Think GB)

    I believe there IS something in store for all of us but it will be manifested in his way not man's. None of us had control over our coming into existence. ..it is a free gift just like what is to come..one thing we know for sure is that the human body don't travel thru space well so if we have a destiny beyond this earth he will have to move us out of here some other way other than our present packaging.

    Just my opinion..I won't DF anyone who disagrees or has other thoughts....like the GB wants for JW's who disagree

  • Knowsnothing
    Knowsnothing

    Hi Laika. You said, " If humankind has the resources to end hunger and then opts not to, why is it fair to criticise others for doing what they assume is the same thing?"

    Well you see, I don't think the issue is as black and white as that. It is true that we have the power to feed a few billion more people than exist today. The problem is there are many things that can hold one back from such a thing, not to mention that in some instances our efforts will be futile.

    For example, suppose I wanted to feed the hungry baby boy you see in the picture. I presume that he is in Africa. Well, I live in the US, and to get him food from here takes considerable expense. Most food perishes within a time limit, so depending on the food I send, I may also have to refrigerate it or process it so as to extend it's expiration date. Then there is the transportation, either via air or water. When it arrives, how can I guarantee someone else will not take it, for the simple fact so many are already starving?

    Well then, you might just object and say, "send more food! What is the problem?" The problem is I as an individual have limited resources of my own, and cannot send much more. I need to form a coalition of some sort, in order to send more food and hopefully achieve my goal of ending hunger at least for that one child. Well, I finally manage to feed the child. As he grows, so too does his family, because he becomes a father of his own. There are now more mouths to feed depending on the same resources... the same amount of food has to be divided up more and more, to the disadvantage of the individual.

    Now add to that situation the scarcity of food and water in Africa, along with its poor administration and the ignorance of the populace in general, and my efforts are simply going to be a drop in the bucket. Millions upon millions will still go thirsty or hungry.

    In any case, let's look at the bigger picture here and see where the problem stems. Resources are limited. Humans like to reproduce and when resources are relatively plentiful, death and illness are low. This means the population spikes exponentially like it has this past century. Even though for a time you will have plenty of people eating plentifully, food production fueled by the limited resource (oil) that sparked this exponential growth will plateau, it will level off, and then MANY more will be hungry and will starve. There will probably even be war over food shortages.

    One looks at this situation and thinks to oneself, if God exists, he has doomed humanity to failure. He put us in a small planet, in a vastly, enormously huge universe that as we know is extremely hostile to life, with limited resources, and with innate desires to reproduce extensively. A designer that has infinite resources and power would not limit their creation to futility. This is one of the reasons I don't believe. It makes no sense, and indeed, there seems to be no evidence of a Creator intervening in our affairs.

  • Laika
    Laika

    Knowsnothing, isn't there someone closer to home you could help? Mankind's problems aren't limited to African children.

  • DATA-DOG
    DATA-DOG

    Good points. I would ask this: If abiogenesis is true and there is no creator, then survival of the fittest dictates that I ignore starving children and pass on my own DNA. So really, who cares? There is no moral obligation on my part to do a damn thing for anyone, not even children in my own area of the world. Why would an atheist give a damn about starving children?

    Also, people like to reproduce as you say. Now if I am an "evolved" human and I see the big picture of how reproduction will eventually lead to starvation, and I choose to have only one child, then my superior DNA has less of an impact on the world. Stupid people are breeding like rabbits and I am practicing self-control? Why?!! So that ignorant less evolved humans can over-populate the Earth?!?

    There is no way humans can solve the issues we are discussing. There is either a divine being that will intervene, or we are screwed, destined to prison terms on a rock floating through space.

  • S EIGHT
    S EIGHT

    Interesting points being raised, some of which point to the thrust of question 3 which I think is worthy of consideration. When I was "in" I prayed for all sorts and quite often encouraged others by expressing how my prayers were answered.

    One example wold would be after delivering a talk. I would be approached by a member of the congregation who would praise me on my delivery. In return I would say (genuinely) that it was Jehovah that helped me through his Holy Spirit which I had asked for through prayer, privately, before stepping on the platform.

    I honestly believed this to be the case.

    But really??

    Did Jehovah really help me? Did he really send his Holy Spirit to help me deliver a good talk while so many other things on earth require his attention?

    This is just one example and I could quote plenty but you get my point...

    It's a common topic of conversation among congregation members where they believe Jehovah has a hand in the goings on but it just cannot be the case when he is needed in far more important situations across the globe.

    S8

  • S EIGHT
    S EIGHT

    @Ding you got me thinking about Bruce Almighty - auto reply yes to all prayers.

    It's an interesting thought - if I were God...

    however, none of us have the mental capacity to comprehend such a notion. It's hard enough being human.

    @knowsnothing - the points you raise are difficult to ponder as I default to the concept that it is mans greed and ruination of the earth that causes famine. I think the earth could provide sufficiently. We messed it up though.

    You make a good point however in regard to our limitations. Yes I could help a local family in need but it's the tip of the iceberg which is why I look to God for the ultimate answer on a global scale. On a very basic level, we all lend a hand as it is human nature. If I have food and you don't, and you're hungry, I will give you some. Simple. Not heroic, just human nature.

    How much more so could our creator do just that...?

  • Comatose
    Comatose

    About Atheist and helping others and survival of the fittest.

    Natural selection got us where we are today. Abiogenesis may have started it all, and genes of the strong should succeed. But, now that we have advanced enough to have support systems and structured care that doesn't mean someone with an Atheistic or Agnostic outlook wouldn't help another person. Not at all. You just don't understand it because you are not an agnostic or atheist right now.

    The very fact that there is no grand plan or grand purpose is what makes me NOW want to help more. Before as a witness I thought it would all turn out okay because god would just fix it all. Now, I see that every day I have to try to do something for others and the world. I have joined a cause that matters to me since leaving. I am teaching my child to give back or pay it forward. WE, all of us, you and I have to do something! We are going to be the future and the reason this human race travels in space in a few hundred years, or leaves earth for a new home in a few million.

    Hundreds of years from now, no one will remember me. But, if my daily attempts to make a change and help others cause them to do one good thing too, then the eventual end to racism and prejudice or the eventual transformation into a species that takes care of all of its children will be my legacy. What I do every day is small. What I do can't be measured in success. But, if everyone did something every day instead of waiting on god, the world WOULD be a better place. All I can do is set an example and motivate others to do good too. All I can do is teach my child and make sure he grows up to be the type of person who also tries to make a difference every day. What I do matters.

    You didn't mean it in a condescending way or a mean spirited way I don't think DD. But, you were wrong, and I need to point it out. Whether or not you believe in god you CAN and SHOULD make a difference every day. How we got here does not have much to do with where we go from here. We choose our future and we make it happen.

  • Bob_NC
    Bob_NC

    Agree and agree.

    How about this...you pray that you do well on your talk. While you are giving your fine, but soon to be forgotten talk, 2 kids and their parents are killed in an auto accident in the same town.

  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    If men created god(s) in their minds including Yahweh, why should one expect a god to do something like protect children.

    if you look at the history of god Yahweh, he doesn't care the slightness to kill innocent children.

    Just one example is when the Egyptians wouldn't released the captive Hebrews, so god Yahweh decided to kill those

    men's children.

  • whathappened
    whathappened

    I saw today on a website someone said why would god care about all the abortions that go on in the world when he has killed so many innocent babies himself. He is not there folks.

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