STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSE'S MOUTH! Possible shift in position from the WTBTS on the global vs local deluge.

by marmot 30 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • marmot
    marmot

    A buddy of mine recently sent me a link to the official WTBTS Facebook page and I thought what the hey, let's see what they have to say about the question that made me fade in the first place. Much to my surprise, they answered! Here's what they said:

    " ******* *****,

    You may already be aware that the general position of Jehovah's Witnesses is briefly stated here:

    http://m.wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2008411

    From the linked article it should be clear that we feel evidence remains that the entire earth was once flooded. The fact is that most of the earth is still "flooded" and would be further flooded if the ice caps completely melted. Many scientists, too, have also presented evidence related to such a flood.

    This does not mean that we judge those who understand things differently as lacking in understanding.

    We are not scientists, of course. and it is quite possible that when one adheres rigorously to scientific precepts, that it is simply not possible for many of them to accept a global flood just 4,000 years ago. Therefore, we have no doubt that scientists are generally quite honest about their understanding of the evidence.

    Even many Bible scholars have rationalized or downplayed the literalness of the Biblical description. This does not mean that such scholars are being dishonest, either. For example, Hebrew expressions for the earth often refer just to the known areas in the Middle East. One Hebrew expression for the earth usually refers only to Israel itself.


    On the other hand, we can still have certainty that a global flood occurred, just as it was described in Genesis. As the article mentioned, the Genesis account was validated again by others, including Isaiah, Peter and even Jesus.

    Science must necessarily limit its reasoning to the available evidence and the available methods of understanding that evidence. This does not mean that new evidence will not be forthcoming. Nor does it mean that the same evidence already in front of us will not be re-evaluated based on forthcoming methods. Science continues to make advancements in many areas of study.

    We would be happy to search out further details if you have more specific questions. Hopefully this may be helpful for now. "

    Granted, they're still clinging to the global flood position but this is the first time I've ever seen them acknowledge even the possibility that the flood might have been local. I'm going to answer back with a few brief points regarding the ice caps and how ice cores show continuous glacial deposition layers going back hundreds of thousands of years and see what they say.

  • adamah
    adamah

    Yeah, I don't think they're saying what you THINK they're saying.

    The WT is saying that they don't think all the scientists and scholars are LYING, per se (and how nice of the WT to admit that they aren't INTENTIONALLY DECEIVING OTHERS, huh?). Instead, they're saying the scientists and scholars are just a bit confused, and are honesty decieved. They're saying that the SCIENTISTS and SCHOLARS are free to examine any "new evidence" if/when it should become available, NOT the WT:they're not scientists, as they admit, but THEY are in contact with God, the deity who ordered the Flood! Besides, Isaiah and Jesus believed in the Flood, so YOU SHOULD TOO! ('appeals to authority', anyone?)

    Utter poppy-cock: there's PLENTY of available evidence on which to conclude a global flood as depicted in Genesis 6-9 is UTTERLY IMPOSSIBLE.

    Adam

  • jgnat
    jgnat

    As an aside, the interactive maps I've seen, with the worst-case scenarios from global warming (6 m rise of ocean) would swallow coastlines and most of Florida, but would not cover the whole earth.

    http://maptd.com/how-global-warming-and-risng-seas-will-affect-us-coastal-cities/

  • sir82
    sir82
    the official WTBTS Facebook page

    This has been discussed on here before.

    There is no such thing.

  • Comatose
    Comatose

    Interesting - "We are not scientists, of course. and it is quite possible that when one adheres rigorously to scientific precepts, that it is simply not possible for many of them to accept a global flood just 4,000 years ago. Therefore, we have no doubt that scientists are generally quite honest about their understanding of the evidence."

    They acknowledge that adhering to scientific precepts precludes a person from believing the flood. LOL

    No sane rational non brainwashed person can believe it. How enlightened of them to concede this point.

    Yes, I'd love to know what they say about ice cores among other things. I have a strong feeling it will be am answer that is wordy but says nothing of substance. It wil reference sciences current understandings and how they change occasionally. Or some other horse poop.

  • cofty
    cofty
    Science must necessarily limit its reasoning to the available evidence and the available methods of understanding that evidence. This does not mean that new evidence will not be forthcoming. Nor does it mean that the same evidence already in front of us will not be re-evaluated based on forthcoming methods. Science continues to make advancements in many areas of study.

    On the basis of this thoroughly dishonest reasoning the earth may turn out to be flat.

  • FadeToBlack
    FadeToBlack

    Ok. Great. So when did these scientists say this occurred? When did this "One such flood' occur?

    Geologists studying the landscape of the northwestern United States believe that as many as 100 ancient catastrophic floods once washed over the area. One such flood is said to have roared through the region with a wall of water 2,000 feet [600 m] high, traveling at 65 miles an hour [105 km/hr]—a flood of 500 cubic miles [2,000 cu km] of water, weighing more than two trillion tons. Similar findings have led other scientists to believe that a global flood is a distinct possibility.

    I'm pretty sure that all kinds of stuff happened in earth's history that nobody was around to witness.

  • marmot
    marmot

    Sir82, please explain what it is that I visited on my iPhone then, and who sent me that response because it looked pretty damn official to me.

  • FadeToBlack
    FadeToBlack

    Funny that they never site the account in Luke: from online NWT:

    Moreover, just as it occurred in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of man: 27 they were eating, they were drinking, men were marrying, women were being given in marriage, until that day when Noah entered into the ark, and the flood arrived and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise, just as it occurred in the days of Lot: they were eating, they were drinking, they were buying, they were selling, they were planting, they were building. 29 But on the day that Lot came out of Sod′om it rained fire and sulphur from heaven and destroyed them all. 30 The same way it will be on that day when the Son of man is to be revealed.

    Sounds pretty local to me: parallel language

  • Londo111
    Londo111

    I agree this is likely not official Watchtower theology.

    It sounds like a JW apologist. Either way, they are talking from both sides of their mouth.

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