STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSE'S MOUTH! Possible shift in position from the WTBTS on the global vs local deluge.

by marmot 30 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  marmot

  Yeah, you're right, upon further inspection, the site reads: We represent a small group of brothers working from Brooklyn Bethel and Patterson, but not in any official media or public relations capacity.

  However, I still followed up with the following question: Hi, I'm ** and thank you for the reply. In response to your offer for further clarification I'll bring up just one more question relative to your mention of the ice caps. It is universally accepted that these large deposits of ice are laid down in stra ta that can be counted both visually and chemically, leaving a reliable record of ice layers that go back hundreds of thousands of years. Tellingly, there is no evidence of a catastrophic global deluge. Is it not possible, then, that the flood was local or even allegorical? We'll see if that merits a reply.
• 

  bafh

  I clicked on the link http://m.wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2008411 and what you quoted is not what they wrote.

  They are not backing off the Global Flood idea.

  And, there is no "Official JW Facebook" page. They are warning people right and left about the dangers, so I can't imagine under what circumstance they would have such a page.

  bafh
• 

  prologos

  fade to black, even these catastrophic floods in western North America were local events, like the possible flooding in the black sea/mediterranian area.

  During the Ice ages there wa LESS liquid water on the planet, not more, people could walk to the Phillipine islands, Borneo, Austarlia.
• 

  Finkelstein

  The first sentence of the article starts off ... The Noahchian Flood occurred more than 4,000 years ago.

  So there are no eyewitness survivors on earth to tell us about it.

  That pretty much lays down where this group of mens intellectual state is situated .

  They also say ...

  Many scientists, too, have also presented evidence related to such a flood.
  
  This does not mean that we judge those who understand things differently as lacking in understanding.

  I'd like to see some evidence from these so called scientists concerning this global flood assertion.

  From all scientific information that has been established, created and documented, nowhere have I once come across

  any information thats asserts that there was mostly likely a global earth wide flood 4000 years ago.

  Someone either is bullshitting through their hats or just assuming their readers are ignorant uneducated sods anyways.
• 

  adamah

  The Noahchian Flood occurred more than 4,000 years ago. So there are no eyewitness survivors on earth to tell us about it.

  Interesting admission to see in writing, since it recognizes that the entire Flood account HAD to be relayed from God (via Holy Spirit) to Moses.

  It makes God's 'regret' admission in Genesis 6 even more incriminating, the passage where God expressed regret for making mankind (AND the animals/plants), where only a few pages earlier in Genesis 1, which after examining his own work in Genesis 1, God had declared as "very good". God apparently hasn't refined an error-free quality-control method either, since he admits making a 'boo-boo' EVEN AFTER assessing His flawed output.

  Adam
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  Phizzy

  Ask them about the plant Kings Lomatia, which survives now, as it has done for 40,000years, and note, I am talking about the original plant, it does not produce seeds, so what we have today can only have come from the plant of 40, 000 years ago, and it cannot survive for even a few weeks submerged in salt water !

  There simply cannot have been a Global flood during the last 40,000 years.

  Edited to add :Sorry, after posting I realised my mistake, Noah must have travelled to the Sothern Hemisphere, picked some Kings Lomatia, and collected some Koalas, some Duck-billed Platypus, and then travelled to South America and picked up the unique wildlife from there, as well as the flightless birds of New Zealand, and after the Global Flood subsided, taken them all back again. And don't forget his massive on board aquarium for all the fresh water fish.

  Simple ! I have written "The Noachian Flood- for simpletons."
• 

  gcs7000

  <<A buddy of mine recently sent me a link to the official WTBTS Facebook page>>

  Proof that not everyone who posts here has both oars in the water.
• 

  adamah

  Phizzy said-

  There simply cannot have been a Global flood during the last 40,000 years.

  Edited to add :Sorry, after posting I realised my mistake, Noah must have travelled to the Sothern Hemisphere, picked some Kings Lomatia, and collected some Koalas, some Duck-billed Platypus, and then travelled to South America and picked up the unique wildlife from there, as well as the flightless birds of New Zealand, and after the Global Flood subsided, taken them all back again. And don't forget his massive on board aquarium for all the fresh water fish.

  Yeah, I find it's pretty much a waste of breath to approach the Flood on the basis of it's scientific impossibility, since any point you raise is only going to be met with a "God Dun It!" defense, where He took care of those messy (unrecorded) little details since it's depicted to be a miracle, anyway.

  I find it's better to start from the illogical and contradictory behavior God displays in the Genesis Flood account itself, and once they're mentally "softened up" by all the inconsistencies in the account (eg God regret, etc), THEN get into the scientific evidence. The believers defenses are down at that point, and they may be ASKING YOU about what science has to say about a global Food.

  Adamah
• 

  Jeffro

  marmot:

  the official WTBTS Facebook page

  Yeah... there's really no such thing. Anyone can create a Facebook page. It's essentially a 'fan page'.

  We are not scientists, of course.

  Don't worry. It's obvious.

  and it is quite possible that when one adheres rigorously to scientific precepts, that it is simply not possible for many of them to accept a global flood just 4,000 years ago. Therefore, we have no doubt that scientists are generally quite honest about their understanding of the evidence.

  Oh, those cheeky 'scientists' with their wiley 'scientific precepts'.

  One Hebrew expression for the earth usually refers only to Israel itself.

  Today, we call that racism.

  On the other hand, we can still have certainty that a global flood occurred, just as it was described in Genesis. As the article mentioned, the Genesis account was validated again by others, including Isaiah, Peter and even Jesus.

  It still could have happened, because characters in other spurious stories said so.

  Granted, they're still clinging to the global flood position but this is the first time I've ever seen them acknowledge even the possibility that the flood might have been local.

  Just remember that it's some JW apologist(s) running the page. It's not official.
• 

  marmot

  GCS7000 wrote:

  Proof that not everyone who posts here has both oars in the water.

  You know what, jackass? I've been out of the cult for five years happily living my life and not generally giving a crap about the witnesses so excuse me if I'm out of the loop when it concerns their official stance on facebook. The mormons seem to be using it to great effect so who's to say the WT hasn't flip-flopped in that time period if you haven't been keeping track?

  Take your condescending bullshit elsewhere, prick. Besides, if you bothered to read the entire thread, I admitted at the top of this page that the facebook site was being run by "a small group of brothers at Brooklyn Bethel and Patterson" so again, kindly f*** off.