Given your perspective, would you rank AA as a cult after reading this?

NeverKnew

A very dear friend's husband is going to AA and has been successfully clean for a year now. He has attributed his success to AA. We are all very excited about his sobriety. Recently, she has found herself alone on many a night that were formerly considered "date nights." There's some work that I'm doing that involves AA. Wondering if pushing to un-involve them would be detrimental to some's sobriety. My stomach turned when I came across a site which gave 100 cult indicators and the ranking of AA to the indicator. http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult_q0.html I'm hoping a few of you will copy and paste the link. I seem to have lost the icon to make my url clickable. YIKES, I have NO formatting options!

DJS

As to whether AA is a cult I will allow others to decide. Does it have cult like qualities? Absolutely. Can it be effective? Of course. Just like any religious cult. However, its reliance on a "higher power" to "fix" those with drug and alcohol dependencies is the thing that makes it most like a religious cult IMHO. Humans have the capacity to "fix" such problems (not to mention the ability to avoid such problems in the first place) within themselves without relying on any imaginary beings. Or needing a religion or AA. I know quite a bit about AA, having had family members and my recent ex-girlfriend go through the program. Making them think that they do not have the strength within themselves and cannot succeed without a higher power are 2 of the most troubling - and cult like - features. Plus it ensures that they complete the initial program and keep coming back for me. Kinda like a religion. Or a chiropractor.

Fernando

I doubt AA is a cult.

However authoritarian control freaks could turn a particular group into a cult.

AA's ritualistic and formulaic approach probably doesn't do much to help either, and can be disempowering.

Personally I find the underlying premise sound: "addiction is a disease of the spirit".

designs

AA can help, does going for 10-20 years help, not really unless you have no place else to go. Biggest steps in AA are to abmit you are an alcoholic and to make amends to those you hurt in your destructive cycle.

DesirousOfChange

AA can help, does going for 10-20 years help, not really unless you have no place else to go. Biggest steps in AA are to abmit you are an alcoholic and to make amends to those you hurt in your destructive cycle.

And to find a "support group" that gives you support rather than condemns you and shuns you when you are attempting to overcome your addiction/sin/illness/etc (you pick the term).

Doc

ShirleyW

A sister in the Hall (whom my mother studied with) husband was with AA for decades, he was even a counselor, or whatever you call it that leads the meetings, I remember her saying that every time they went away on vacation the first thing her husband did was look up the local chapter of AA. I always thought that he did that to fight the temptation to have a drink while on vacation. But what's kinda funny about it being cult like is, first thing he did on vacay was look up the nearest AA and the sister looked up the nearest KH, which is what many Dubs do when they're away, so it is kind of cult like.

OnTheWayOut

I am not really active in AA anymore, go to a meeting every once in a while.

They can feel very much like a cult with their chants and sayings and the "higher power" stuff. The difference is that you can go without contributing, you can remain anonymous, you can choose to not participate in any portion of the chants or prayers. I even found a group that is for atheistists, agnostics and avoids much of the cult feeling.

It ain't for everyone, but it's better than being drunk. I have hopes that people don't make it replace something else and find themselves going to AA 3 times a week for life, but learn to use it occasionally.

SAHS

I have been a member of AA, “on and off,” for some years. It has worked fairly well for me, although I have had quite a few relapses. (My bad, not AA’s.)

I do think that the group from which AA branched from, called the “Oxford Group,” was somewhat cultish. It was started in 1931 by Dr. Frank Buchman, who was an American Lutheran minister and Christian missionary. It became popular in England, Germany, and America. I believe that the Oxford Group was sincere, but that they were also a rather fundamentalist religious movement with definite political overtones.

However, the Alcoholics Anonymous (AA) movement – which started by Bill Wilson and Dr. Bob Smith in 1935 as simply a neutral fellowship of support – distanced themselves from the Oxford Group and formed their own kind of “charter,” the “Twelve Traditions” (formulated sometime after the “Twelve Steps”).

But unlike dictatorial cults such as the Jehovah’s Witnesses (JWs) – who require all their new members to agree completely with the questions for baptism as outlined in their book Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry – the Third of the “Twelve Traditions” of AA simply states, “The only requirement for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking.” Also, unlike the JWs – who are led by a group of eight men dictators who call themselves the “Governing Body” (which now apparently also comprises the entire “Faithful and Discreet Slave”) – the second half of the Second Tradition of AA states, “Our leaders are but trusted servants; they do not govern.” Moreover, the Ninth Tradition of AA begins by stating, “AA, as such, ought never be organized” – as, of course, opposed to the “we’re the one and only true organization of God in the whole world” mentality of the JWs. As well, AA’s Twelve Traditions state that AA “has no opinion on outside issues” (#10), and also that their “public relations policy is based on attraction rather than promotion” (#11).

So, to answer the question of the OP “NeverKnew,” which was “would you rank AA as a cult after reading this?” – and, by the way, I did, in fact, read the entire materials regarding AA on the “orange-papers.org” Website a while ago – I have to say that it is not a cult in the general, classic sense of the word, especially considering the points I mentioned above from their “Twelve Traditions” (their “charter”). Simply put: AA is not an organized organization with leaders who govern. They don’t shun, they don’t recruit, they don’t try to deceive and enslave, and they’re not antisocial or destructive. (And they certainly would never force you to let your children die without a necessary medical procedure.)

Now, the JWs, on the other hand – well, all I can say about them is: “C-U-L-T!” (No more explanation needed.)

Hortensia

well, one thing about cults is the damage they do. I don't think AA does much damage. It certainly does plenty of good for those who have the problem and need the ongoing support.

Nathan Natas

That's a GREAT link!

http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-cult_q0.html

I've never been involved with AA, but I met a guy through work who was. We were attending a multiweek training for work and were located in a town far from both our homes. We had separate rooms in a motel and spent most of our time before and after class and over the weekend in each other's company. One of the first things my co-worker did was establish contact with the local AA group and he went to those meetings after work during the weeks were were in training. It seemed to me that AA encourages alcoholics to swich their alcohol addiction to caffeine and nicotine addiction. Is that progress? Maybe it is. At least thy're not driving drunk. Instead they stink and have the jitters.

I encourage everyone to take a look at the link. Good material there.

Given your perspective, would you rank AA as a cult after reading this?

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