She downloaded the JW Library app which has the parallel versions of a verse, and upon looking at John 17:3, she said the above to me. I wonder if this will start causing chinks in the armor for many JWs, especially when they look up John 14:14 or Rev. 5:10. The months ahead should be interesting.
Wife says "John 17:3 is just like Christendom's translations!"
by leaving_quietly 13 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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TD
LOL - I guess by that she means that the revised NWT doesn't change the subjunctive verb, γινωσκωσιν (they might know) into a noun (knowledge) and insert a verb construction (taking in) that is not in the original text at all?
In other words, it's finally translated correctly.
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leaving_quietly
Yeah, what you said, TD. LOL!
Actually, I pointed out to her that the way it's translated now is closer to accurate, and that if she looks at the Interlinear (one of the parallel bibles in the app), she'd see it. She said the Interlinear is "too confusing". I think she simply doesn't want to think all that much.
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sir82
I found this change surprising - John 17:3 is THE scripture used to bolster the WT concept that "taking in knowledge" (i.e., studying WT-produced literature which shoe-horns Biblical concepts into WT dogma) is the first step leading toward baptism.
For decades the baptism talk at assemblies and conventions have hammered on this "taking in knowledge = studying the Bible (via our publications of course)" concept.
I guess they can still make that point, but it's not nearly as straightforward with the revised wording in this verse.
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Apognophos
As I said in another thread, this verse comparison feature (which is like BibleHub, something I've been using since I learned TTATT but which most JWs probably don't know about) could be a bad idea, in that it will demonstrate to some JWs that there was really no need for a new NWT after all, when it's simply gotten closer to a bunch of old Bible translations from Christendom.
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Terry
Like any criminal seeking escape from penalty, the Governing Body has returned to the scene of the crime to remove damning evidence.
The Internet has shined a bright light on the malfeasance of Fred Franz.
A little here and a little there, Franz stitched and snipped and cut and pasted and [bracketed] and finessed the existing
Watch Tower ad hoc doctrines into the New World Translation.
Over a period of decades, so-called apostates have forced attention to be directed on these violent and insidious intrusions into text.
So often in the past, the Organization has attempted to rebut indiscriminately in Watchtower articles and such. The rank and file
could care less, for the most part. But, the (excuse the use of this word) intelligentsia at Bethel have very large egos and wound easily.
These revisions salve their wounds.
I repeat:
Like any criminal seeking escape from penalty, the Governing Body has returned to the scene of the crime to remove damning evidence.
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Apognophos
I tend to agree with Terry. There was a fair amount of defensiveness at the Annual Meeting over things like the addition of "Jehovah" to the NT that made me think that the GB was feeling stung by criticism of their translation (why only now, I have no idea).
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warehouse
As I said in another thread, this verse comparison feature (which is like BibleHub, something I've been using since I learned TTATT but which most JWs probably don't know about) could be a bad idea, in that it will demonstrate to some JWs that there was really no need for a new NWT after all, when it's simply gotten closer to a bunch of old Bible translations from Christendom.
Talk about mind reading, this is exactly what I was thinking, even as the guy was showing it at the AM. I even thought, "wow guys, r u sure? there's no undo on this one, once you start down the verse-by-verse comparison path, there's no turning back". I guess with all the other apps out there, BibleHub, BibleGateway, etc. the GB finally broke down and realized that they are actually way behind in providing tools and information for study. And they'd rather the R&F use society approved crap instead of outside tools and info.
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leaving_quietly
I use biblehub.com, too. Great set of tools there.
I was stunned when they said they were including the Kingdom Interlinear. I mean, let's just put the NWT side by side with the Greek and looky what we have here!!! (Rev 5:10 anyone?) And if there's any doubt to "over the earth" vs. "upon the earth", one could look at the actual Kingdom Interlinear inside the front cover to see the visualization of certain Greek works, including those that translate to "over" and "upon". I mean, wow...
As for the defensiveness, they used a lot of the same doublespeak at the Annual Meeting. "Some critics say" this or that. "Many scholars recognize" this or that. Obviously, no actual names were named. But, since it was a GB member saying it, it must be true! (or so the average JW will think and not even bother to check into it.)
The continue to harp on inserting the name Jehovah in there. In fact, in the Appendix on page 1721, it gives a list of things that a reliable translation must do. Number one on that list: "Sanctify God's name by restoring it to its rightful place in the Scriptures. Matthew 6:9" I told my wife that there are plenty of translations out there that do that in one form or another. Some use Jehovah. Some use Yahweh. Some use YHWH. The NWT is not the only Bible with God's name in it, so I don't know why the Society is harping on that. That's old news with regard to bible translation.
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XBEHERE
I actually turned to this scripture first when I got the NNWT, I was shocked but also pleased that yes finally its translated correctly.