I have never understood how they know Jesus returned. What is the evidence they use?

by Faithful Witness 19 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Faithful Witness

  I just finished reading the articles that tell us that the last 100 years of turmoil are supposed to be proof that Jesus is on the throne.

  I have always been confused about this, especially when I compare it to what the bible says about his return.

  Matthew 24:27 says, "For just as the lightning comes out of eastern parts and shines over to western parts, so the presence of the Son of man will be."

  This is immediately following the statement at Matthew 24:24, where Jesus says, "For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will give great signs and wonders so as to mislead, if possible, even the chosen ones. 25 Look! I have forewarned YOU. 26 Therefore, if people say to YOU, 'Look! He is in the wilderness, do not go out; Look! He is in the inner chambers, do not believe it.' "

  Isn't this second part, exactly what they are doing, when they say Jesus is on the throne for the last 100 years? Claiming his invisible return?

  I'm usually a pretty good student. I'm not sure if our teacher left something out, or if it just wasn't there... Can anyone here explain to me how they actually know that Jesus returned in 1914? Surely, they have more than the outbreak of WWI to back up that claim.

  It seems like they are using the 1914 return of Christ, as a foundation for most of their beliefs about themselves. I am missing something, and I don't know what it is. Can anyone clarify this for me?
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  Anony Mous

  Their proof is that Jerusalem got destroyed in 607BCE (which it didn't) and then they use some Gematria on random Bible verses to come to 1914
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  Faithful Witness

  No, really... Didn't Jesus say everyone would know when he came back?

  They came up with a way to calculate the date, which is exactly what Jesus said not to do.

  What is the sign of his actual presence? Havoc in the world? Is that it? Because I think we have had troubles for centuries before 1914, also...

  What am I missing? (I'm not trying to be a smart aleck. I really don't understand this!)
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  Tater-T

  and they got out of jail... they knew they were guilty, so, it must have been devine intervention
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  Faithful Witness

  Matthew 24:42

  "Keep on the watch, therefore, because YOU do not know on what day YOUR Lord is coming."

  Did he change his mind, and decide to tell Charles T. Russell? Or should I say, did he allow CTR to have the knowledge to calculate the dates, and then correct his interpretations a couple of times before he died?
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  Oubliette

  Believing something doesn't make it real.

  Holding on to a belief when there is no real, tangible evidence to support it and all the evidence contradicts it is irrational and delusional.

  If Christ REALLY returned 100 years ago, why was it invisible to EVERYONE except Charles Taze Russell? All the WT leaders since have based their beliefs on Russell's attachment to this date and the corresponding assertions of invisible, unprovable beliefs.

  In fact, a few minutes of research will reveal that what Russell believed was going to happen in 1914 is most definitely NOT what JWs believe today. Russell believed it was going to be, not the beginning, but the end:

  "But bear in mind that the end of 1914 is not the date for the beginning, but for the end of the time of trouble . - Zion's Watch Tower, July 15, 1894, p.226

  Russell actually believed that Jesus' presence started in 1874, not in 1914. Very few current JWs know this. Why? Because the WT has revised its own history to cover this fact up. It doesn't fit with what they currently believe nor with what they want you to believe.

  As Paul Grundy explains on JWFacts.com, "It was not until the Golden Age, 1930 Apr 30 that it was said that Jesus [sic] rulership started in 1914. This was repeated in the 1931 booklet, The Kingdom, the Hope of The World and then the Watchtower in 1932:

  "In 1914 Jehovah placed his royal Son upon his holy hill in Zion..." Watchtower, November 1, 1932, p.325

  

  This was 14 years after Russell's death.

  The sad truth is this: the WT leadership are a bunch of misguided, delusional fools that believe that they--and only they--have been chosen by God. They are adored by millions of equally deluded followers that blindly believe whatever the current WT leadership tells them to believe.

  Proof of this is the recent doctrinal changes in the July 15th, 2013 WT. One Sunday morning a few weeks back the vast majority of JWs believed all of the anointed alive on earth as a group comprised the "Faithful and Discreet Slave." Later that day, after the routine WT Study Indoctrination Session, all of the faithful JWs on the earth turned a mental switch and then came to believe that it is only the GB as a group that are the "Faithful and Discreet Slave."

  Who choses your beliefs?
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  Phizzy

  They have no proof whatsoever, that stands any scrutiny at all, that Jesus "returned" in 1914.

  And of course, you are right, everything else they teach that is unique to the JW/WT religion, hangs on this one teaching.

  So, everything that would point to them being God's Organization hangs on this 1914 nonsense.

  Make your JW show you how it is arrived at, don't interrupt during the explanation, just take notes. Then come back here to us and we will shred it. Or if you are happy to do so, tear it apart yourself.

  It is simply not good enough for them to expect you to take stuff "on faith" when they have given you noreason to habe faith in anything they say.

  Make him prove it.
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  snare&racket

  Just as a thief in the night..... who stays on your sofa for 100 years +
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  L3G

  Some thoughts--not that I am defending them! They draw a distinction between Christ's coming and his presence (different Greek words). For the invisible presence thing they draw on the OT concept that Jehovah was invisibly present in the cloud that was with the Israelites wandering the wilderness for 40 years and Jesus coming in the clouds (Acts 1:11, Rev 1:7). For the meaning of presence as not simply coming they draw on Paul's words at Phil. 2:12.

  Again, I'm not defending their position, but that's some of what I remember. Others at this forum are more learned in the WT publications (for example, Blondie) than I am. Perhaps they can offer more here for you.
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  Oubliette

  L3G: For the invisible presence thing they draw on the OT concept that Jehovah was invisibly present in the cloud that was with the Israelites wandering the wilderness for 40 years

  Um, did it occur to you that the Israelites could actually SEE the cloud? What do JWs' SEE today, besides the WTBTS? Nothing, absolutely nothing.