Can WTBTS legally do this for international conventions.

by joe134cd 21 Replies latest jw friends

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  joe134cd

  I was just reading this on JWServey with regard to the international conventions.

  “If an individual selected to attend a special convention loses his exemplary status and is no longer qualified to attend, the delegate should be thoroughly informed of the reason for your decision. Such a person would be fully responsible for any financial loss associated with his abrupt disqualification as a delegate, even up to the time he was supposed to depart.”

  So my question is??? Purely from a legal point of view is, once I have paid my money and tickets issued, is there any way that the society could prevent me going on the tour if fell out with them.?? If they could physically stop me from going, would they have to refund me my money??? Obviously they don't think they have to. Is this breaking the law???

  i suppose it's a bit like, a person buying an item in a shop, and once the transaction is done the store owner refuses to hand over the items, or give a refund because he found out she was gay.
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  Iamallcool

  Good Question. (bookmarking)
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  JWdaughter

  A tour? If you were buying your own hotel and transportation, why would they need to pay you back? If it is a tour group, what does the agreement say as to how they can exclude you or not? It is simple, but the WT can not likely be held in any way responsible for your costs for a convention that you can not or do not attend. UNLESS there is an admission fee and they refuse you admittance or to refund it. Last I knew, they didn't charge admission (well, there was the Tacoma Convention parking scandal). Hotels and transportation: if a tour, I think they have to let you on the tour if you paid for it-they just don't have to let you into the event if your privileges have been recinded. If the tour coordinator is JW, it would BEHOOVE them to refund you, unless they wanted an unworthy JW in their midst for all weekend or whatever.
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  prologos

  Wow, why does Wt not sign up all weak, fading , marked, members and then inform them they are not really qualified and pocket the money?

  thank you? sue me? see you in court?. Is this convention tours?

  ARe conventions not open to the public, even to publicly reproved, disfellowshipped ones?

  so, it is the money train that gets bled of the money?
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  Tech49

  Simply put, no, they cant stop you, and dont have the authority or ability to do so. They dont have mall cops on duty, checking ID. Its all a percieved power trip, one that you would essentially have to allow youself to be a victim of.

  That being said, I have seen it a few years ago, where a brother in our congregation became "disqualified" from attending an international convention, for allowing his DF son to live in his home.

  He "allowed" himself to be pressured into forfeiting the trip with his family, with non-refundible tickets. He was pretty upset about it.

  Its all a mind game, its all about control, .... but control that you willingly give up.

  With this recent set of instructions regarding the upcoming international conventions, I mentioned to someone that we may just go to one on our own, without making special arrangements with the WT tour groups and packages. They were truly horrified! "You can't do that !!!" Um, yes I can.... who's gonna stop me? They dont have guards at the doors, for goodness sake. And yes, they are open to the public...they are just another DC with more people from different areas. Its just another way to forcefeed you with control and fearmongering for being disobedient to "instructions" from the Most Holy GB.

  The mind games are ridiculous, insidious, and infantile.

  Tech49
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  GLTirebiter

  As far as pre-paid exenses go, that depends on the contracts signed (if any), who are the parties to the contracts, and which jurisdiction's laws apply to them. Not knowing those things, even a legal professional can't say if it's legal.

  But whether or not it is legal, unless somebody pushes back the result is the same. An exemplary (sheep-like) Witness is unlikely to question decisions of the Watchtower Society, so most often the Society will have their way. Tech49's example illustrates how this works: the brother surrendered without significant resistance, and the Watchtower Society wins by default.
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  joe134cd

  I would think once the money is payed and tickets issued, then there is nothing that they could do to stop me going on the tour. I dont even think that they could legally even stop me from attending the convention. Hey if they want to tell me I can't go, that is fine but I would fully expect to get a refund. I think legally if someone took them to task over it, they would loose. But I'm no lawyer.
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  steve2

  I think the instruction is regarding attendance at a special convention not tours. My understanding is that a place at a special convention is by designated name so if you become disqualified after being designated a place, you'd lose your designated place. Because it is a special convention and is not open to the public, you would not be able to do anything about it. Besides, if an organization clearly outlines the terms and conditions of entry prior to your selection and subsequent spending money, they can virtually carry out the cancellations if you are adjudged to have broken the terms and conditions.
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  joe134cd

  Yeah must be able to get away with it. Other wise they wouldn't of said it
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  Jen1

  I thought all district conventions worldwide were open to the public thats why jws go around with leaflets 3 weeks before to invite everyone in the world, and that work is done worldwide. So you can make your own arrangement in theory but the reality is jws see it as a going against the organisation and do not like it at all.

  This is what gets me if you join a tour to a convention to another country you have to pay way to much money the cost is unreasonable, so only the rich can afford it, the ones who have good full time jobs which they got because they went to university/college! You have to dress jw style the whole trip! If I had that education and could go I could never sit for hours at the airport and on the plane in meeting clotes! I hate sitting for 2 hours in meeting clothe