Kim's call to HQ's... (page 9)

Newly Enlightened

But if they lied to me about the 'Mentally-diseased' term/comment I don't believe them about whether they really don't have a Youtube channel or not...time will tell.

Stayed tuned for our video challenging JWDefense....

adamah

Outlaw said-

The difference is.. The WBT$ service desk is handing out public information..To the Public..Over the Phone..

The information asked about,is also public..It`s been Printed in WBT$ magazines.. The WBT$ Rep chose to lie about what was already in the public domain..From a WBT$ Phone dedicated to answering questions from the public.. Are the authorities really interested in charging sombody who has caught the WBT$ in a Lie?!.. I doubt it..LOL!!.. Maybe the WBT$ can be Charged for lying to the Public over the Phone..

This is not an issue of copyright infringement (as is indicated by mentioning the 'public domain' angle). It's a PRIVACY issue, and the U.S. courts ruled long ago that phone call participants have a reasonable expectation of privacy in their homes and places of business (which is quite unlike when you're out and about in public, where someone often CAN record you without giving consent, depending on State laws).

Like I said, it's a good idea to consult a lawyer who knows Federal and State privacy laws before performing a stunt like this, since it may be illegal, depending on whether the person lives in an "all party, one-party, or two-party" state (It would likely be legal, if the caller lived in NY State and called Brooklyn, since NY State is a 'one-party' state; however, calling across state lines makes it a matter for Federal law, and becomes more confusing).

Uploading the video to YouTube is a separate legal matter, since that's an invasion of privacy issue (which is separate offense from the wiretapping laws), and is a separate civil matter, NOT a criminal matter (felony wiretapping).

But legalities aside, as an atheist I fail to see how flagrantly disregarding laws is consistent with claiming to be a Xian: it's doubly ironic to do so in the name of lying to other Xians to catch them lying (which isn't even against the law), esp when the subject is their interpretation and usage of 1 Timothy.

Adam

flipper

KIM- Very well done on your part ! My wife and I just watched it, been busy with work until today. Great job. Both of these WT reps are so over protective of the WT Society's legal status ( which is probably how they are trained to answer questions in this position ) that they'll lie like dogs just in order to protect WT interests. Or else lose their OWN WT position of " phone answer reps ". As you found out like many of us do ( I called them about child abuse policies once ) that WT corporate interests are the first priority- telling the truth is the last option or almost never an option. Good job exposing this through your you-tube, thanks for sharing ! Keep the great work up ! Say hi to hubby ! Peace out, Mr. Flipper

Newly Enlightened

Thank you everyone. From the comments and private emails we are getting, at least a few current JW's have watched it and are shocked at what HQ's said. So if nothing else, current JW's are watching and thinking.

konceptual99

Hi NE - enjoyed the video. My thoughts/comments are:

1 - it's the same guy

2 - I am not 100% sure he lied. To ex-jws and those who are fading then the term "mentally diseased" has been a big thing but to most of the R&F it's simply not on the radar. They can't remember what they heard 10 mins after the meeting has ended so even if the guy is a bethel elder it can't be certain he would remember such a phrase

3 - It would have been interesting to hear what his reasoning would have been if pushed more on the meaning of the term. As Adamah points out, the phrase in the context of the original greek is not a million miles off if (and I stress if) you understand the idea of the wording to imply an unhealthy obsession with arguing over words rather than a clinical description of mental illness. The WTS does not make the distinction in the WT article nor in the outline for the DC talk and the question is if this is intentional. I wonder what the response would be if the guy had been pushed on this? It is interesting that the RNWT renders it in a way more consistent with the original idea but this was not suggested by the guy in the video.

4 - I have a similar thought on the matter of shunning. The guy deflected the argument over association by using the FAQ which technically worded to avoid conflict with passages such as the one from the Jan 15/12 WT. The guy was there for the taking and I was just waiting for the killer question about what would happen with family members that no longer lived at home and the level of association permitted with them.

5 - I would bet big money that JWDefense has nothing to do with WT HQ. The videos are weak, poorly made and add nothing to what is available on jw.org. The WTS is very careful about what they put out and how they do it. The PR machine is accelerating all the time and sites/blogs/youtube channels like JWD do nothing to help. It's just some ego somewhere with too much time and not enough sense.

Anyway - thanks for spending the time calling them up and making the video!

Newly Enlightened

Flipper: Thank you.

I have made a DVD of this youtube video and have sent it to my mom with a post-it note on it saying to listen carefully what the brother tells me @ 29 minutes about shunning.

In case you didn't see Mikey's follow up video....that scripture they claim they are quoting from at 1 Tim 6:4-5 is taken totally out of context!!! so it doesn't matter what the original Greek implies, it plainly states that those 'mentally diseased' are despoiled of the truth, thinking that Godly devotion is a means of gain." In other words the mentally diseased ones are the ones that use reigion to get rich!

Apostates are not getting rich, tearing down the Watchtower, babel & crap society....

thanks everyone for your comments...

Kim

flipper

A really informative thread which will help lots of newly exiting JW's

Newly Enlightened

Thank you Mr. Flipper....everyone.

Kim's call to HQ's...

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